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Chris Carpenter seems to have forgotten one of those unwritten rules he cares so much about

Oct 25, 2011, 12:33 PM EST

St. Louis Cardinals starting pitcher Chris Carpenter celebrates after getting Texas Rangers' Mike Napoli to fly out and end the 6th inning of Game 5 of MLB's World Series baseball championship in Arlington

Last night, after giving up a homer to Adrian Beltre, Chris Carpenter retired Mike Napoli on a long fly out to end the sixth inning.  After the fly ball, Carpenter appeared to yell multiple expletives at Napoli. Expletives that begin with the letter F and which seem to say “Good sir, you may have thought you were going to do something productive there, but you did not. Thus (a) you should go have intercourse with yourself; and (b) you are a portion of excrement.”

Or maybe he didn’t. Maybe he was just yelling “Motte” but everyone misheard him.  Either way, Big Legaue Stew has video of it with someone filling in the words that seem to fit Carpenter’s words, but be VERY forewarned: it’s loud and profane. It’s funny too, but that’s beside the point.

All of which makes me wonder about Chris Carpenter. About how he justifies his own behavior in light of the fact that he once famously called out a player for yelling at himself. That took place in 2010 when Carlos Lee popped out in a key situation and, angry at his failure, appeared to chastise himself for it.  The theory behind Carpenter’s anger at that: you don’t disrespect the pitcher by implying that the failure was your own as opposed to you being dominated by said pitcher. Yeah, I know, that sounds crazy, but at the time, Carpenter’s manager Tony La Russa said that Carpenter was totally in the right:

Pence hits the ball out of the ballpark. Carp didn’t make a good pitch. Carp doesn’t say a word. He doesn’t say anything to the guy that hit it. It’s his mistake. Well, routinely now, hitters pop up a pitch they think they should deal with and they start making noises, and that really is disrespectful to the pitcher. Most of the pitchers just turn around and ignore it. Carp doesn’t. I think Carp’s right, and I think Carp’s in the right. Respect should go both ways.

“If he gets you out, he gets you out. Zip it and go back to the plate. If he gives it up, you zip it and let the guy go around the bases–or single, double, whatever it was. Most pitchers let the guy
jabber. I don’t think Carlos Lee is anything special as far as a guy who disrespects, but it’s so common now. Carp will let you know.”

Respect should go both ways. Hitters should shut up no matter what, even if they’re not talking to the pitcher at all, but the pitcher can call the hitter a “piece of sh**” and give him the old “eff you” when he pops up.

Man, I’m glad we have Chris Carpenter around to keep us straight on all of these unwritten rules. They’re so complicated!

  1. manifunk - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:37 PM

    The Cardinals are the most hypocritical franchise in the majors

    • fearlessleader - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:51 PM

      Are you basing that assessment on actually following the Cardinals, or on following the media coverage of them, which has gleefully adopted the narrative (sometimes accurate, often not) of the Cards as a dour, grouchy, blame-diverting bunch? TLR, Carp, and Pujols can drive me insane, too, but I’ve been a Cardinal devotee for 30+ years, and I don’t know when I’ve ever seen a team having this much fun and connecting this well with the fans, either. If I got all my news from HBT—which I adore, by the way—I’d have a very different view of the franchise.

      • churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:10 PM

        Unfortunately [like fans of the franchises], there are dbags and there are great fans. You can see both on display at all sorts of sites, like espn.com chats with Keith Law for instance.

      • manifunk - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:17 PM

        I watched a few of their games, follow their reporters on twitter and know a few of their fans. Their hypocrisy is obvious in all these avenues, not just HBT.

        As for “fun”, as much as I despised the Giants last year and am sick of the Brian Wilson Experience, they looked like they were having lots more fun than the Cards have.

      • Chris Fiorentino - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:35 PM

        Some Cardinals fans chastised me for saying that Cliff Lee blew game two of the NLDS…saying I was disrespecting the Cardinal’s offense. Then the exact same fans try to make a case that the Cardinals are handing these games to the Rangers, thus disrespecting the Rangers offense. Not all Cards fans mind you, but there are hypocrites in every crowd. Oh well…

      • fearlessleader - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:46 PM

        Chris, can’t both be true? The Rangers have hit well—not up to their usual standard in these last two games, perhaps, but they’ve capitalized on every mistake and seized important scoring opportunities—while the Cards have screwed up inning after inning, on the field and in the dugout.

        Manifunk, that’s a pretty small sample size, and if you really follow the Cardinal reporters on Twitter, you know they’re the LAST ones to make excuses for this team. (Check out Bernie Miklasz and Bryan Burwell on stltoday.com this morning for a taste.)

      • Chris Fiorentino - Oct 25, 2011 at 2:08 PM

        Fearless, when you are a fan of the Cardinals, then absolutely both can be true.

      • fearlessleader - Oct 25, 2011 at 7:44 PM

        Chris, if the Cards don’t admit their screw-ups, they’re accused of being haughty and ducking responsibility. If they do, they’re accused of disrespecting the other team. If they open their mouths, they say the wrong things. If they say nothing at all, they get in trouble for avoiding the media. I get the feeling a lot of folks on HBT would be happy if Tony La Russa simply vaporized.

        Don’t get me wrong—I’ve got plenty of problems with Tony. But the anti-Cardinal rancor on this board is getting wearisome.

    • lakerfan32 - Oct 25, 2011 at 11:52 PM

      I’m a. 40-year Cardinal fan and agree. Can’t wait for this era to end. The price of success with TLR is a gut ache.

  2. halladaysbiceps - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:40 PM

    Chris Carpenter is a punk in my opinion. Does anyone remember what he did in Game 5 in the NLDS in the Cards/Phillies series? I believe it was the 7th or 8th inning. I forget who got the 3rd out for the Phillies, but afterwards Carpenter started to yell and scream like he hit a game winning homer in the 7th game of the WS. I though to myself “you POS. Stop acting like a punk out there. Roy Halladay would never act like that.”

    • b7p19 - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:46 PM

      While the constant comparisons to the holier than thou Phillies players are getting old, you are right. Carpenter seems to be a bit of a b!t#$. I guess Zach Grienke was right?

    • halladaysbicep - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:49 PM

      Then I “though” to myself “Wait, Roy Halladay has never been to the World Series. Maybe he would act like that given the situation”

      • halladaysbiceps - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:51 PM

        I don’t think so, piece of shit imposter.

      • halladaysbicep - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:55 PM

        Fake HB, you have no credibility when it comes to thinking.

        Anyone can check my blog and verify that I am the true HB.

    • spudchukar - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:54 PM

      Keep piling on boys, it only inspires us.

      • halladaysbiceps - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:58 PM

        I know Carpenter is your guy, spuds. I get it. But, this guy is a hypocrite. Some of his shenanigans on the mound are uncalled for.

    • fearlessleader - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:05 PM

      Well, Roy Halladay considers Carp one of his best friends, so either Carp’s not that bad a guy or Saint Roy has crappy judgment….. :)

      • halladaysbiceps - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:08 PM

        I think they act differently on the field entirely. It has nothing to do with Carpenter off the field. He’s probably a great guy. But, his actions on the field sometimes are questionable and bush league.

      • cur68 - Oct 25, 2011 at 2:30 PM

        Woa, HB. Props, man. The faceted nature of people is little questioned when it comes to popular figures. Carp the pitcher and general ass-bag does not equal Carp the off field person, father, friend etc. Be nice if more people made a point of remembering that. Be a lot less wholesale demonizing going on.

    • Clinton Manitoba - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:13 PM

      I seem to remember Halladay being a little bit of a bitch himself during Game 1 of 2010 NLCS. He wasnt getting the typical “Halladay Strike Zone” (the one he got for the NLDS no hitter).
      He was huffing and puffing, kicking dirt around.

      • halladaysbiceps - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:17 PM

        That’s between Halladay and the umpire. He does it when he feels he’s being squeezed by the umpire. Completely different than this Carpenter hypocrite who claims he doesn’t like being showed up by a hitter but will do it himself when he feels the need to.

      • halladaysbicep - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:24 PM

        It’s between Halladay and the millions of viewers (including children) that tuned in to watch the game.

        You can’t be the best every single time you walk on the field. You think someone like Albert Pujols should act like a bitch because the umpire called a pitch a strike and because Albert is the best, and if he didn’t swing it couldn’t have been a strike?

      • trigzter - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:44 PM

        you’re trying to compare “huffing and puffing” to what carpenter said? Good joke.

    • philiplewis1 - Oct 25, 2011 at 3:27 PM

      I didn’t know much about Carpenter as a person before the playoffs but I’m beginning to REALLY dislike him. Since I’m not particularly a Cardinal fan, I’m not faced with the dilemma of having to root for someone I really don’t like. We keep hearing throughout this series about young pitchers getting their emotions under control. Wonder how good Carpenter could be if he could do the same.

  3. vanmorrissey - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:41 PM

    Yep, caught that one too, Craig. It was quite apparent what he said. Could Zack Grienke have been on to something?

  4. fearlessleader - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:43 PM

    Not to split hairs, but there’s a substantive difference between “F you” and “F yeah,” isn’t there?

    Regardless, none of it’s as bad as the stuff I was yelling at MY television last night.

    • sdelmonte - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:34 PM

      Didn’t we tell you not to watch Castle?

  5. lar @ wezen-ball - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:44 PM

    Don’t forget that the whole Morgan/Carpenter/Pujols dust-up was started by Morgan reacting to something Carpenter did earlier, but somehow Nyjer gets 100% of the blame…

    • spudchukar - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:51 PM

      Hey Lar, the Morgan thing was started when he was playing for Washington. He blind-sided Cards catcher Anderson as he turned his back to him when a throw was cut-off from the outfield. In all my years watching it was one of the most egregious plays I have ever seen, and I for one will never forget it. It would have been a penalty in hockey. So the Cards have an ax to grind, and his attention starved mentality offers little chance that St. Louis, led by Carpenter, will bury the hatchet.

  6. kmgannon - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:44 PM

    Typical Cardinals. They’re always in the right when the situation suits them, but when something goes wrong, it’s always someone else’s fault–and they take no accountability for it, whether it’s dodging the press, blaming the lights, or hanging the bullpen coach out to dry.

    I was already rooting hard for Texas, but the Cardinals are really making it tough for anyone to like them, much less root for them to succeed.

    • Tyree Studio - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:48 PM

      or blaming Denkinger for 85 when there was still a game 7 left to play?

      • thefalcon123 - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:57 PM

        # of current Cardinals who had anything to do with the 1985 team: 0

        That’s kind of like saying, “oh those Cardinals. These are the guys who wanted to boycott Jackie Robinson!”

    • b7p19 - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:49 PM

      I also hope Texas wins the series, but I think you’re “Typical Cardinals” explaination could really be applied to every team in the league. Except the Phillies of course.

      • kmgannon - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:53 PM

        I think the Cards have taken it above and beyond what other teams do. No team, from the manager on down, is so quick to blame anything and everything else when things don’t go their way. And the excuses are mind-blowing. The lights too bright during your at-bats? Really? The noise was so loud that “Motte” sounds like “Lynn?” It’s OK for me to yell all sorts of crap when I am pumped up, but you can’t show any emotion at all when your team plays mine? I don’t know what’s worse–the constant whining and grousing, or their assumption that fans won’t see through the crap.

      • kmgannon - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:54 PM

        By the way–I’m a Cleveland fan, and couldn’t care less about Philly. Just to go on record.

    • rollinghighwayblues - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:00 PM

      kmgannon, don’t forget the rowdy towel mix-up when Holliday missed that low line drive last year.

      • kmgannon - Oct 25, 2011 at 2:08 PM

        Ah yes, I had forgotten about that one…and it was some of their finest work! :)

    • spudchukar - Oct 25, 2011 at 7:51 PM

      You know what is truly typical Cardinal baseball. That they are playing for the World Championship and your team isn’t. Aesop had it right, and you are just a Fox, disappointed cause the grapes are out of your reach.

  7. aleskel - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:45 PM

    hey, there’s an easy explanation for all this. Carpenter is from Exeter. Everyone in New England knows that folks in Exeter have mouths like stevedores.

  8. El Bravo - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:46 PM

    Carp remains a ‘nozzle. In fact, I’m throwing him on my 2011 list for his glaring hypocrisy. The list, over 2/3 through the year now, stands as follows:

    1. Luke Scott
    2. Hank Steinbrenner
    3. Lenny Dykstra
    4. Carlos Silva
    5. Richie Whitt – Dallas Observer
    6. Jay Mariotti
    7. Willy Aybar
    8. Frank McCourt
    9. Roger Clemens
    10. Chris Carpenter

    Honorable mention: cake lovers

    • halladaysbiceps - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:50 PM

      Your list seems sound, with the exception of Hank Steinbrenner. What did he do to make your list?

      • churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:55 PM

        Arod contract is enough for me!

        He’s also the blowhard [along with Randy Levine] Steinbrenner while his more intelligent brother, Hal, is busy behind the scenes with Cashman.

      • El Bravo - Oct 25, 2011 at 3:01 PM

        Reminder: only 2011 nozzle-i-ness is considered for inclusion on the 2011 list. If not, the list would be a million people long for poop’s sake! So anyway, Hank?

        Hank made the list this year b/c in the early spring he apparently insinuated that, according to my horrible notes, “[his] team isn’t rich enough and poor teams whine too much”. This surely was in response to some sort of revenue sharing question. HBT posted about it earlier this preseason, so it’s out there somewhere…

      • churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged - Oct 25, 2011 at 3:45 PM

        Don’t forget, he probably was the one who also commented about people’s mansions (cough Jeter cough).

    • 18thstreet - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:50 PM

      You deserve a standing ovation for not letting politics influence your list.

      • El Bravo - Oct 25, 2011 at 3:02 PM

        I know a douchenozzle when I see one.

  9. uwsptke - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:49 PM

    So now it appears Nyjer Morgan was probably telling the truth about what prompted him to throw his chew at Carp. And Greinke doesn’t appear to be too far off base on the fact that opposing players generally don’t care for the guy either.

    • uwsptke - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:53 PM

      Not to mention that after having broken one of baseball’s unwritten rules that he cares so deeply for, it’s time to echo what Carp once said after witnessing the brawl between the Cards and Reds:

      “How will I explain this to my son?”

      • churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:56 PM

  10. largebill - Oct 25, 2011 at 12:53 PM

    All humans are hypocrites to some extent or another if we compare what they/we complain about to their/our behavior. It is just more obvious with famous people who have their hypocrisy on display for all to see. It does seem much more of an issue with the Cardinals and I have to assume that is due to their manager being a sanctimonious ass.

  11. franklapidus316 - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:10 PM

    yeah….but he may or may not be friends with Roy Halladay, TBS never gave us a clear picture on that.

  12. presidentmiraflores - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:13 PM

    At least we couldn’t hear what he said this time. I am outraged that FOX broadcast this thug’s profanity into my home during Game 1. Watching this circus animal strut around the mound yelling expletives degraded me as a person and did irrevocable damage to my children. FOX should be ashamed of themselves.

    • fearlessleader - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:37 PM

      “Degraded you as a person”? “Irrevocable damage to [your] children”? Wow, and I thought *I* was dangerously over-involved with this sport…..

      • cur68 - Oct 25, 2011 at 3:15 PM

        pssst, ‘leader; set your web browser to ‘irony &/or sarcasm’. Its in the menu on the toolbar under ‘nuances’ when you use the fauxfox web browser.

  13. lembeck4 - Oct 25, 2011 at 1:55 PM

    Good piece Craig, glad to see I wasn’t the only one thinking his behavior was hypocritical, and tacky.

  14. sanzarq - Oct 25, 2011 at 2:17 PM

    Carpenter’s really good (on the mound), but he’s also a foul-mouthed dirtbag. I’m definitely giving Nyjer Morgan the benefit of the doubt now. As for Larussa, someone should make sure his longterm healthcare insurance policy is paid up. He may be checking into a home sooner than you think.

  15. xpensivewinos - Oct 25, 2011 at 2:29 PM

    Funny how every one was up in Greinke’s grill for calling Carpenter out about a week and a half ago.

    He’s having an “I told you so moment” right now.

    • skids003 - Oct 27, 2011 at 1:06 PM

      Him and his beautiful spouse.

  16. 23yankees - Oct 25, 2011 at 2:51 PM

    Carpenter is classless.. He belongs on the Philadelphia Eagles.

  17. cshearing - Oct 25, 2011 at 2:58 PM

    I have no problems with either if the things Carpenter did (last night’s game or game 5 of the NLDS). While I do respect the stoicism of a player like Halladay, I realize people are different. I enjoy emotion from players, as long as it does not bubble over into idiotic play.

    What I have a problem with is him having a problem with others doing the exact same thing. I dislike hypocrisy and double standards as a rule, and like when I am called on my own hypocrisy. Everyone does it from time to time, of that there is no doubt. Carpenter? You’re being called on yours.

  18. brewcrewfan54 - Oct 25, 2011 at 3:20 PM

    Carpenter is a jerk. It’s pretty obvious. I dont have a problem with him yelling the first part but calling Napoli a piece of shit? Come on. Greinke wasnt wrong. And I think anyone whos watched the Cards play can say that their douche baggery is always alive and well.

  19. paperlions - Oct 25, 2011 at 3:26 PM

    I’m on board with some cardinals being hypocrits; they clearly are….Tony, Carpenter and Pujols have all taken things the opposition has done personally…and when they did similar things they said the opposition shouldn’t take it personally because it wasn’t directed at them…well, neither was the stuff you took personally. Yeah, SOME of the Cardinals are thin skinned hypocrits.

    But if we are going to paint an entire franchise based on the actions of a few…well, then based on comments of Philly fans on HBT, they must be the most obnoxious and least informed fan base…and there really isn’t a close second….maybe Cardinal fans

    • Jonny 5 - Oct 26, 2011 at 8:13 AM

      While I do get your point, was it really necessary to degrade Philly fans to make that point? I doubt it. That was Bush League bro.

      • paperlions - Oct 26, 2011 at 8:21 AM

        It was in response to the giant mountain of crap in the post spewed by two Philly fans.

      • Jonny 5 - Oct 26, 2011 at 8:26 AM

        I’ve been dying to say “that was Bush league bro” Don’t mind me…

  20. terrik2525 - Oct 27, 2011 at 2:11 PM

    As a Cardinal fan I have to admit that I didn’t like what Carpenter said. But at the same time I have to admire his pitching skills. We all have said thing in the heat of the moment myself included especially when I played ball and screwed up. As far as Grieke goes, he was a crybaby when he was here in KC and seems he hasn’t changed since he went to the Brewers.

  21. txnative61 - Oct 28, 2011 at 3:01 AM

    It’s just smack down trash talk, like lots of pro athletes indulge themselves. Well, except Mariano Riviera, which make him even more remarkable.

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