Comments on: Red Sox, Cubs table Epstein compensation talks

By: headbeeguy

headbeeguy — Fri, 18 Nov 2011 14:44:26 +0000

@shaggylocks: The Sox would probably help their negotiating leverage if they weren't torpedoing the reputation of the asset they're trying to get compensation for. What are they going to say? "Give us Garza or we're taking him back"?

By: headbeeguy

headbeeguy — Fri, 18 Nov 2011 14:36:58 +0000

@brucewayne: At least they’d lead the league in OPSBIs

By: dan1111

dan1111 — Fri, 18 Nov 2011 11:30:23 +0000

Also, this is quite different from, say, a bench coach or an assistant GM leaving to take over somewhere else.

By: dan1111

dan1111 — Fri, 18 Nov 2011 11:27:13 +0000

You can be sure the Sox would not be pursuing this if they did not have contractual authority to do so.

Would you like it if your team to let its star player walk away before his contract was up, because he decided he wanted to play somewhere else? Why is this situation any different?

By: brucewaynewins

brucewaynewins — Fri, 18 Nov 2011 04:35:02 +0000

@old gator

If that’s the case then why didn’t the Cubs hire Jim Bowden. He isn’t Jim Hendry…. /sarcasm

By: Old Gator

Old Gator — Fri, 18 Nov 2011 04:21:56 +0000

Right. The Cubs will wind up giving the Beanbags Aramis Ramirez.

By: Old Gator

Old Gator — Fri, 18 Nov 2011 04:21:03 +0000

Why are Cubs fans so excited? Because he isn't Jim Hendry. Think about it.

By: mqcarpenter

mqcarpenter — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 23:54:03 +0000

There is no freaking way they are getting Castro. I do propose a sign and trade for either Zambrano or former all star Sammy Sosa.

By: shorttracknews

shorttracknews — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 23:29:19 +0000

Our best pitcher (even though he isn’t showing it) is Carlos Zambrano. So let Boston take him and in fact take our best longball threat to…Soriano is yours as well.

By: eldon67

eldon67 — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 22:02:47 +0000

Instead of getting a player, the Sox should insist that the Cub’s take Lackey and his contract

By: WhenMattStairsIsKing

WhenMattStairsIsKing — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 21:38:42 +0000

By the way, is your name a Keith Richards reference? Nicely done.

By: WhenMattStairsIsKing

WhenMattStairsIsKing — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 21:38:15 +0000

You’re right; San Diego let TWO guys walk in a quick swap of pieces, while Boston’s looked like a petty thug for a month.

If I’m an executive, I’m thinking Moorad > Henry, by a million miles, in terms of good employment.

Whether San Diego was easily able to replace Hoyer with Byrnes or not doesn’t matter, especially since Cherington was more than ready in Boston.

The only thought here is that Henry is falling into the Baltimore/Miami-level of attractive employer at this point.

By: WhenMattStairsIsKing

WhenMattStairsIsKing — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 21:35:40 +0000

It’s cool how Boston apparently does not care at all how petty they look, and how attractive they want themselves to look in the eyes of future executives.

While I’m not thrilled the Cubs haven’t finalized it either, I can’t blame them for waiting for Boston to come down to earth after asking for their best players in return for someone who’s never had a plate appearance.

I understand Theo is an important executive, but this is partially uncharted territory, and the issue is likely that they’re comparing apples to oranges when figuring out compensation; a suit for a bat.

If I’m the Cubs, I offer a mid-level prospect or 2 high-ceiling prospects and if Boston still says no, then let Old Man Selig get around to it sometime within the next century.

By: xpensivewinos

xpensivewinos — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 20:49:03 +0000

It does seem rather peculiar that the level of compensation was not established (in writing) before the Red Sox let Epstein walk out the door.

The Cubs pulled the same move with the Padres for their front office people.

Something doesn’t ad up.

By: Alex K

Alex K — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 20:27:16 +0000

It all depends on the player. It isn’t unreasonable to ask for something like that. I think the Red Sox would rather get a minor leaguer at that point. They would be more valuable (more years of control). Any major leaguer the Red Sox would want is most likely too valuable for Epstein.

By: shaggylocks

shaggylocks — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 20:07:01 +0000

Fine, asking for Garza or Castro is asking for a lot. But why is everyone saying that they’ll most likely settle on a minor leaguer or two? Why not, say, a bullpen pitcher or bench player?

By: Matt Aromando

Matt Aromando — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 19:30:38 +0000

This is how negotiating works, Red Sox start high, Cubs start low, and they reach middle ground.

By: bigharold

bigharold — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 19:17:42 +0000

Exactly what leverage do the RS have at this point?

Forget that once Epstein started to negotiate with the Cubs he’s essentially worthless to the RS. Do you really want a guy that is interested in working for another team being the lame duck GM considering all the other things that happened at the end of last season? Now that he’s gone what’s the logic behind the Cubs offering anything important? What, the RS are going to take him back? They’re going to force the Cubs to find another guy? I’d love to be the lawyer billing for that law suit.

Epstein’s gone and at this point that only hope they have of getting ANYTHING of significance is if Selig steps in and forces the Cubs to part with something important, .. but it sure ain’t going to be Garza. Considering that thanks to Selig the RS to John Henry was pretty much a bag job it’s not beyond the realm of possibility that the Cubs might be forced to over compensate, so a lot is possible.

This appears to be another chapter in the RS 2011-12 off season misadventure melodrama. They’re worrying about which minor league player they’re going to get from the Cubs while they’re closer just left town, they don’t have a manager and the pitching has more holes in it that a Zucotti Park tent after the NYPD helped the OWS crowd “relocate”.

By: brucewaynewins

brucewaynewins — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 19:16:43 +0000

@MSS16

If Theo is as good as most Cubs fans believe/say and he was as responsible for the recent success and World Series win(s) for the Red Sox….Then yes he would be worth something significant. If he isn’t then why are Cubs fans so excited? You don’t get so excited over something average or unproven.

By: Alex K

Alex K — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 19:14:02 +0000

If the reports are true then the Sox didn’t just ask for any major league player(s). They asked for either the teams best pitcher or position player.

It’s all about value over a replacement. It is easier to find someone who has Theo’s skillset than it is to find someone who is as good at baseball as Castro or Garza.

By: rdssc

rdssc — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 19:13:00 +0000

He was a GM in Boston and is now President of Baseball operations in Chicago. In most cases executives and coaches are let out of their contracts with no compensation to take on a position higher up the management chain. Boston is being ridiculous with their demands. They should just be happy he changed leagues, and focus on finding a new manager. Seeing how they have handled their business since the last month of the season Red Sox fans can look forward to a lot more years of no WS rings.

By: shaggylocks

shaggylocks — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 19:05:00 +0000

To be honest, I kind of don’t understand why a throw-away prospect is considered a fair trade for the team’s chief architect. Why is asking for a major league player so unreasonable? Someone please tell me; I’m really asking.

By: aceshigh11

aceshigh11 — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 18:59:01 +0000

Yeah, but on the other hand…Theo is a dreamboat. I mean…look at that hairline. You can’t BUY looks like that.

By: mss16

mss16 — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 18:57:15 +0000

Leave it to the Red Sox to be greedy d*#&s about this. I mean you seriously think a GM is worth the Cubs’ best position player or pitcher. Just go away.