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The Blue Jays wanted Clay Buchholz for John Farrell

Nov 25, 2011, 11:20 AM EDT

John Farrell

We learned the other day that the Red Sox tried to talk the Blue Jays into letting them interview John Farrell for their open manager’s job.  The Blue Jays, however, have a policy of not giving permission for their people to interview for lateral moves, so that didn’t go anywhere.

But the Jays weren’t totally closed to the idea:

According to a tweet from David Waldstein from the New York Times, the Blue Jays asked for Clay Buchholz as compensation if the Red Sox were going to hire away John Farrell to become their manager.

Which of course the Jays knew was never going to happen.  In asking for Buchholz, the Jays came about as close to a chuckling eff-you that one team can give another team in such situations.

I’d like to think that after they said that there was a moment’s pause on the phone and then the Sox and Jays guys both started laughing and then Ben Cherington said “well, I had to ask, right?”

  1. uyf1950 - Nov 25, 2011 at 11:43 AM

    Turn about is fair play. From all reports the Red Sox wanted Matt Garza for Theo Epstein. Hopefully now they realize how ludicrous that request was.

    • hoosierdaddy12 - Nov 25, 2011 at 12:12 PM

      How can anyone dislike this comment? It’s spot on.

    • bigharold - Nov 25, 2011 at 12:33 PM

      ufy, … beat me to it.

    • grudecks - Nov 25, 2011 at 3:14 PM

      UYF1950…..Agreed on the request for Garza/Buchholtz being equally ridiculous….seems that the difference between the two situations is that we asked what the cost of acquisition would be up front and when we didnt like the answer both parties moved on with no harm done…..regarding Cubbies, they have our former GM while the cost of acquisition is still being debated. I really question why we didn’t clearly define what we wanted in return before agreeing to let Theo negotiate/leave.

      • uyf1950 - Nov 25, 2011 at 3:44 PM

        If you want my opinion I can only think of 2 reasons.

        First, the Red Sox ownership were glad to “get rid” of Theo regardless of their public comments to the contrary.
        Second, and you may like this answer even less. That is the ownership really doesn’t have a clue.

        Take your pick. Sorry, but that’s what my feelings.

      • bigharold - Nov 25, 2011 at 6:36 PM

        ” I really question why we didn’t clearly define what we wanted in return before agreeing to let Theo negotiate/leave.”

        The question why wasn’t the compensation settled first would seem to be, as suggested, either they really didn’t want him and this allowed them to rid themselves of a GM with a minimal amount of fall out or they, the RS owners, are inept. I’d think the LL really wanted Epstein gone and he saw his opportunity.

        One could argue that Epstein was interviewing for a higher position and that is generally allowed but it’s not an etched in stone rule. But, once the RS allowed the the Cubs to interview Epstein he had one foot out the door, once he agreed to go they lost all leverage with the Cubs.

    • 4que - Nov 26, 2011 at 2:31 AM

      Garza for Epstein wasn’t an absurd request at all. First of all the new Cubs owner had to sign Epstein after all the media hype about Epstein going there plus there were rumors that Garza was on the trade block so why not initiate a dialogue? Secondly, the Red Sox are playing chess not checkers. They knew they wouldn’t get Farrell but they were sending a message to Farrell not to renew his contract with the Blue Jays because they’ll sign him in 2 years. Farrell still lives in Boston and has kids going to school in Boston as well as a sick child who’s being treated at a Boston hospital. I bet the Sox hire Bobby Valentine for a couple of years and then offer Farrell the managers job when his contract is up in a couple of years. Larry Lucchino isn’t a dummy.

      • Alex K - Nov 26, 2011 at 9:59 AM

        Garza for Epstein is 100% absurd. There is never a situation where that is fair compensation.

      • uyf1950 - Nov 27, 2011 at 9:47 AM

        4que – spoken like a true homer. Let’s take the other side of the argument. The Red Sox shouldn’t get anything they really didn’t want Epstein around any longer anyway. As soon as John Henry went on record that he was against the Crawford signing he not only threw Epstein under the bus he ran over him and backed up and ran over him again.

        As for your comment about Larry Lucchino, anyone who’s instrumental or scapegoats both the Manager and GM for the Red Sox September failure and forces them out considering they are responsible for the only 2 World Series Titles a team has won in nearly 90 years isn’t exactly a “rocket scientist”. At least that’s my opinion.

    • kcloutier - Nov 28, 2011 at 2:30 PM

      At first glance yes it may be a joke but, Garza has thrown a lot of fastballs in his career and he really didnt overhwelm the weaker NL hitters this year. Much like when the Red Sox were interested in Scott Kazmir, he went west and his arm was gone after that (9-15 in 2010). Buckholtz is still a kid and hopefully has a lot of arm left where as Garza, maybe. But who else could you ask for when the Cubs wanted him so badly?

      My issue is why the Sox didnt go after Seattle’s Felix Hernandez. Now thats soneone you can plan to have for a few years and it would have been another Cy Young arm from someone you dont play often and can get AL hitter out.

  2. pisano - Nov 25, 2011 at 11:45 AM

    In other words the Jay’s were telling the Sox to go f** k off.

    • proudlycanadian - Nov 25, 2011 at 1:57 PM

      More like a swift kick in the gonads.

    • troy10 - Nov 25, 2011 at 3:14 PM

      Yeah.. that’s pretty much what the article pointed out as well there Einstein. Way to “read between the lines”.

  3. cur68 - Nov 25, 2011 at 12:02 PM

    Anthopolus trying the old mind tricks again, eh? Well I’m glad the force is strong with Cherington otherwise I do believe Clay Bucholtz would be on his way to Beaver Land. You’d have thought the conversation with Tony Reagins would have ended with laughs regarding Vernon Wells, but there was that result right there. That’s why Reagins is no longer GM: the force was weak with him.

  4. hoosierdaddy12 - Nov 25, 2011 at 12:03 PM

    “Which of course the Jays never new was going to happen.”

    First – “new” is spelled incorrectly. Second – assuming you correct “new” to “knew”, the sentence should read “Which of course the Jays knew was never going to happen.” What ever happened to proof reading? Not your finest moment, Craig.

    • purnellmeagrejr - Nov 25, 2011 at 12:19 PM

      it was kind of a mess but I knew what he meant.

  5. hoosierdaddy12 - Nov 25, 2011 at 12:06 PM

    Also…..Ben Cherington would be the guy being asked, not doing the asking. Good grief, what a terrible post!

    • cur68 - Nov 25, 2011 at 12:19 PM

      Hey there Bubba. You do know what you’ve just done, right? Now, upwards of a dozen people will be proofreading your every comment looking for inaccuracy, spelling mistakes and grammatical errors. Not to mention the Cosmic Jokester (I like to think of this being as a cross between a stern headmistress, Steve Jobs & George Carlin) who doesn’t like to be thwarted by interwebs spelling/grammar police who don’t themselves make an error while posting corrections like a school marm. Nice work with that, by the way, because its like some kind of law; make a mistake while correcting another. You’ve dodged that…for now…

      • pisano - Nov 25, 2011 at 1:10 PM

        cur68… great advise about the grammar thing. I also made that mistake of correcting another poster, and was told by a poster pretty much what you said. In no time flat I was corrected for my error’s, so the moral of the story is as long as you can make sense of the story, let the corrections slide on by. There is one exception to the rule, cur68, I’m sure you remember “urteamsuxs52” that poster didn’t get passed the third grade, but that being said, there’s always one in the crowd.

      • cur68 - Nov 25, 2011 at 1:24 PM

        I miss that guy “urteamsuxs52″. I’m certain he was paperlions or maybe Old Gator channeling a composite of dense people who’s work he’d had to correct at some point. There’s no way a single real person is that stupid. It was so funny I laughed non stop reading his postings. Ahh, lowest common denominator…where are you now, when I need you, in the off season of my discontent…

      • hoosierdaddy12 - Nov 25, 2011 at 6:31 PM

        Hey there, Bubba. There’s an easy solution to the scenario you presented – use proper grammar! It’s really not that hard. Is it possible that I’ll make a mistake once in a while? I guess it’s possible. But unlikely.

        I can promise you this though – I will never bungle a sentence as bad as “Which of course the Jays never new was going to happen.” That’s a sentence a third grader would write. Also, the Cherington mistake may actually be worse.

      • bigharold - Nov 25, 2011 at 6:45 PM

        “I can promise you this though – I will never bungle a sentence as bad as “Which of course the Jays never new was going to happen.” ”

        And if you do, .. I promise you that, as suggested, .. guys will be tripping over themselves to let you know about it, ..and every other mistake you make large or small, .. grammatical or otherwise. Congratulation, you just turn blogging about baseball, an endeavor that should be amusing and enjoyable, in to the SATs.

        So you got the going for you.

      • cur68 - Nov 25, 2011 at 8:08 PM

        Hey Bubba. Glad I checked back here before heading out for the evening. Took a while for you to get back to me, I notice. Spent a tense hour or two proof reading and trying for just the right turn of phrase, eh? The effort shows. Hope you got lots of stamina for it if you plan to keep commenting…

    • marinersnate - Nov 25, 2011 at 1:08 PM

      Leave Craig Alone!

      • hoosierdaddy12 - Nov 25, 2011 at 10:25 PM

        It took a while to respond because I was out playing football and shopping for Christmas gifts.

        It’s not my goal to turn this blog into the SATs. But this is a pretty significant blog that’s had millions of views and is backed by NBC Sports. I expect better than this awful post. I guess you don’t. To each his own.

  6. dirtyharry1971 - Nov 25, 2011 at 1:15 PM

    this might have worked out for boston, i mean Clay is probably a free agent in the next couple of years and when that happened you know the jays wouldnt even try to resign him cause they are soo cheap cheap cheap and broke broke broke!! In the end boston would have gotten the manager they wanted and Clay back in probably 2 or 3 years if they really wanted him that badly. Get ready for 4th place again jays!!!

    • cur68 - Nov 25, 2011 at 1:26 PM

      Bless you ‘harry. Please post a lot this off season, eh? You always make me smile. How’s the probation coming along?

      • proudlycanadian - Nov 25, 2011 at 2:02 PM

        I always suspected that Harry was also urteamsuks. On another forum, Harry once used the moniker Dr. Bendover.

      • cur68 - Nov 25, 2011 at 2:22 PM

        You know what the opposite of love is PC? Indifference. Haters, by this definition, actually care enough to hate. ‘harry cares about the Blue Jays. It sort of endearing in a way. He takes the time to get on here and other boards and take jabs at you and our rooting interest. He isn’t too bright. He is a likely recidivist and a definite troll but at least he cares. I can count on him like I can count on my doggie using my neighbor’s fence as a bathroom spot, with similar results.

    • marinersnate - Nov 25, 2011 at 1:27 PM

      Buchholz signed long term with Boston last year. He is signed through 2015 with club options for 2016 & 2017.

    • atwatercrushesokoye - Nov 27, 2011 at 12:14 PM

      The Jays actually have a TON of money, they’re owned by one of the biggest corporations in Canada and Paul Beaston and Alex Anthopolous have been assured that when they feel the Blue Jays are ready to make their move all they have to do is ask and Rogers will give them the money to take their payroll well North of $100 million.

      I know it’s pretty easy to assume they’re broke with them owning their own stadium and also owning 5 sports channels, and the company having a net income of $1.2 BILLION dollars last year…but you’re wrong!

      You should also pay attention to the nice young core that AA has put together with the Jays, this is probably the deepest they’ve been with good young players since the mid 80’s. By 2013 this team will be a legitimate threat to win the AL East.

  7. jjschiller - Nov 25, 2011 at 1:20 PM

    Actually, that joke is stated correctly, Smart Guy. If you took time to consider the real world situation being discussed, before showing off that giant brain of yours, you’d realize that Cherington was the one initiating negotiations for a person he was already told was unavailable. It is Cherington asking what it would take, and Anthro answering with what it would take.

    I know its complicated, as you’d have to follow two whole logical progressions, so I’ll go ahead and spell it out for you:

    Cherington: “So we really can’t talk to Farrell?”

    Anthropolous: “I told you, no interviews for lateral moves. He’s not available.”

    Cherington: “Oh come on, what do you really want here? I’m sure we can make it worth your while.”

    Anthropodopilis: “Oh, well, I guess so… we’ll take Buchholz.”

    (both laugh)

    Cherington: “Haha, whooo, that’s funny. I guess you really mean it, he’s not available. Can’t blame me for trying!”

    See, if Anthropodopolopolis said it, it wouldn’t be characteristic of his role in the actual negotiations.

  8. cowboysoldiertx - Nov 25, 2011 at 3:59 PM

    I want to trade my old truck in for 25 horses and a hundred head of cattle but it prob wont happen either!

  9. thegonz13 - Nov 25, 2011 at 4:53 PM

    @cur68… For the record, “Beaver Land” has a name. It’s CANADA!

    • proudlycanadian - Nov 25, 2011 at 5:53 PM

      cur68 is a canuck and like me, he is a big fan of beaver pelts.

    • cur68 - Nov 25, 2011 at 6:01 PM

      @thegonz13: I KNOW. For the record: Its called HUMOUR. Get some…

  10. dirtyharry1971 - Nov 25, 2011 at 5:54 PM

    I was The doctor you are correct proudly but i was never that other one. You see when you do what i do the golden rule is to never take credit for something you didnt write and i would never do that. I do hope you were more impressed with the doctor :)

    proudlycanadian – Nov 25, 2011 at 2:02 PM
    I always suspected that Harry was also urteamsuks. On another forum, Harry once used the moniker Dr. Bendover.

    • proudlycanadian - Nov 25, 2011 at 5:58 PM

      Thanks for the clarification Harry. There are times when I value your baseball insights.

  11. mempusa - Nov 25, 2011 at 9:05 PM

    Craig, lay off the bud when you blog bro. That’s middle school journalism right there

  12. dirtyharry1971 - Nov 25, 2011 at 9:06 PM

    well i wish i can say i come here to be insightful but that wouldnt even be close to the truth. You see these boards are loaded with morons and i just get a kick out of playing with them and they dont even realize it. Its like shooting fish in a barrel if you know what i mean

  13. turdfurgerson68 - Nov 25, 2011 at 10:11 PM

    Not the same…Garza is nowhere near the talent Buchholz is

  14. steelerfan55 - Nov 26, 2011 at 9:00 AM

    get the fuck out of here

    • dirtyharry1971 - Nov 26, 2011 at 2:32 PM

      steeleROIDS suck and the Ravens OWN them this year and they lost the SB last year. With that said you get the F out of here loser

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