Comments on: A position-by-position breakdown of the best players not in the Hall of Fame

By: RickyB

RickyB — Sat, 14 Jan 2012 18:02:47 +0000

I was growing up during Grich’s and Whitaker’s playing days, and I didn’t think of them as future Hall of Famers either. However, just because they weren’t considered future Hall of Famers while they played is no reason to dismiss their candidacy for the Hall. The writers of the time didn’t treat them as all-time greats, so people didn’t think of them that way. Enlightenment came around in the form of sabermetrics to the mainstream after they were done playing, and now people can appreciate how special those players were. Going on gut feeling is how we end up with the current situation with the voters. There have been a few writers to state they believe Biggio will get in on the first ballot. I’m betting there are enough “gut” voters out there that will keep that from happening, even with the 3,000 hits.

By: paperlions

paperlions — Sat, 14 Jan 2012 17:06:42 +0000

If you don’t see it…it is because you don’t realize how good they are compared to 2B through the history of baseball. It is very rare to have 2B that are good both offensively and defensively. Since WWII, Whittaker and Grich are both top 5 or 6 2B, they were that good and consistent on both offense and defense….which is rare…both were better than Biggio and better than Sandberg…..just not as hyped.

By: hushbrother

hushbrother — Sat, 14 Jan 2012 15:56:14 +0000

Grich and Whitaker aren’t Hall of Famers. Come on. I’m old enough to remember them, and I think they were both really good, underrated players. But all-time greats? I don’t see it.

Neither of them were as good as Darrell Evans, for example. Or Dwight Evans, for that matter.

By: streatordave

streatordave — Sat, 14 Jan 2012 15:34:40 +0000

I still want Pete Rose in the min. they let the PED Kids in.

By: vikesfansteve

vikesfansteve — Sat, 14 Jan 2012 14:53:34 +0000

Because there was no DH in that WS & Hal Mcrae was subjected to being a pinch hitter.

By: 78mu

78mu — Sat, 14 Jan 2012 00:36:48 +0000

Piazza hit like a corner outfielder or first basemen and played defense like one. Bench was miles better at defense but not enough to dismiss Piazza as a catcher. I’d take Bench over Piazza on my team any day but if I needed a hit I would rather send up Piazza at his best than almost any hitter.

If you could build a catcher from scratch he’d end up looking like Bench. Piazza may have been a better hitter and contemporaries like Boone or Sundberg may have been slightly better on defense but no one was the total package like Bench.

By: churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged

churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 23:38:43 +0000

Mike Piazza was good but he was never better than Johnny Bench at anything

Piazza – .308/.377/.545/.922 – 142 OPS+
Bench – .267/.342/.476/.815 – 126 OPS+

O rly? Bench was probably a far better defender, but no way you can say he was a better hitter.

By: royalsfaninfargo

royalsfaninfargo — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 23:23:07 +0000

I know you are big on Sweet Lou Whittaker Craig, but another overlooked 2nd baseman is Frank White. He is the reason Lou didnt win more Gold Gloves. In ’85 White was the first 2nd baseman to bat cleanup in the WS since Jackie Robinson.

By: metalhead65

metalhead65 — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 22:35:08 +0000

Mike Piazza was good but he was never better than Johnny Bench at anything.not his fault nobody was despite whatever saber stat you invent that says he was slightly better at he can’t be better than the best catcher of all time. sorry stopped reading after that.

By: jimatkins

jimatkins — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 22:26:37 +0000

Nice to know I’m not the only person that appreciates Bobby Grich. I own exactly one autographed baseball, and it’s one of his.

By: skipperxc

skipperxc — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 21:48:45 +0000

That’s another thing, baseball nicknames have really stunk the last ten or twenty years. Funny you should mention him specifically — I first learned his name only a week or two ago. If only he’d ever played with The Human Rain Delay.

By: 18thstreet

18thstreet — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 21:39:41 +0000

What’s inconceivable is the way the Royals handed out huge contracts. I seem to remember the Storm Davis signing being a sign of the apocalypse — that the Royals were scooping up all the best talent.

By: skipperxc

skipperxc — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 21:20:47 +0000

I wasn’t even born until ’86. Sometimes I feel like I missed all the best stuff. The Yankees have been good my entire cognizant life — it’s hard to think of them as anything but the gold standard for franchises. And the Royals winning a title? Inconceivable!

By: churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged

churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 21:19:10 +0000

Jack Morris?

By: churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged

churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 21:18:37 +0000

Because he spits hot fire?

By: cur68

cur68 — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 21:15:44 +0000

Morris’s mustache has more WAR than anyone else’s mustache.

By: paperlions

paperlions — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 21:11:00 +0000

Fact: Jack Morris has over 200 more wins than any other 1B, 2B, C, SS, 3B, DH, or OF….that is not in the HOF.

By: genericcommenter

genericcommenter — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 21:07:20 +0000

Time flies. I’m pretty young, but I find it pretty hard to accept the existence of baseball fans so young that they don’t know who led the AL in HRs in 1985.

By: 18thstreet

18thstreet — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 20:59:21 +0000

No one fielded to the score like Morris.

By: Kyle

Kyle — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 20:53:06 +0000

“Laughter and tears are both responses to frustration and exhaustion. I myself prefer to laugh, since there is less cleaning up to do afterward.”

By: paperlions

paperlions — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 20:37:47 +0000

I can help you with that:

Best player at each position not in the HOF

P: Jack Morris
C: Jack Morris
1B: Jack Morris
2B: Jack Morris
3B: Jack Morris
SS: Jack Morris
LF: Jack Morris
CF: Jack Morris
RF: Jack Morris
DH: Jack Morris

By: tmohr

tmohr — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 20:26:27 +0000

I’m old enough to remember well Evans as a player, but my first thought of him is always that he believed (and perhaps still does) in UFOs.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1064898/index.htm

By: kopy

kopy — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 20:21:57 +0000

‘Cuz we’re in a recession, damn it!

By: churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged

churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 20:19:17 +0000

Bah damn paywall . Running out of excuses why I haven’t bought a subscription yet.

By: DJ MC

DJ MC — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 20:16:58 +0000

I only know Darrell Evans from articles like this, that try and show why he should be remembered. Otherwise, nothing.