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Theo Epstein compensation watch: the Cubs send Chris Carpenter and a PTBNL to the Red Sox

Feb 21, 2012, 12:03 PM EDT

Chicago Cubs President of Baseball Operations Theo Epstein speaks at a news conference at Wrigley Field in Chicago Reuters

No, not that Chris Carpenter. He’s still a Cardinal. This is the Cubs reliever. Who will now be a Boston Red Sox in exchange for the Cubs hiring away Theo Epstein. There will be a player to be named later too, so it’s not like this is ever ending, apparently.

Not a significant player, really. Carpenter has a total of 10 major league games worth of relief duty under his belt. He throws hard but walks a lot of guys. He has spent four seasons bouncing around the Cubs’ system, posting a 21-19 record and a 3.62 ERA and some fairly high walk rates in 96 games, 60 of which he started.

He’s 26, so he’s not a prospect, but it’s possible that he could become a major league reliever if he could improve the command a bit.

  1. sleepyirv - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:08 PM

    Remind me why this is taking so long.

    • tone360 - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:36 PM

      Because Boston is crying, they thought they were entitled to Matt Garza. Hahhaahaa. Woe is me, poor Boston.

  2. comeonnowguys - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:08 PM

    Still a tad too much.

    Though Red Sox fans will probably cry that it wasn’t Castro and Garza.

    • 24missed - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:51 PM

      Wait? It wasn’t Castro and Garzo? Excuse me for a moment, I’m choking up and tears are streaming down my face. Are you sure it wasn’t Castro and Garza?

      Although PTBNL, could be Garza. Theo will probably throw in Castro, just to alleviate the RS fan base, because we cry.

      I’m just having fun with you.

  3. crpls - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:10 PM

    He shares my name AND I got to see him pitch a few times in short season.

  4. diehardcubbiefan4life - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:11 PM


    • patsandsox - Feb 21, 2012 at 2:27 PM

      My sentiments exactly. Its done, at this point I didnt care anymore. Once it was certain the Sox couldnt make Theo take Lackey, Jenks, or DiceK with him, I lost interest.

  5. lorddarkhelmet - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:12 PM

    seriously, they argued over THIS!?

    • bloodysock - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:16 PM

      Theo valued Lackey and Bobby Jenks, so yes.

    • baseballisboring - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:15 PM

      Well…yeah, cause presumably the Sox wanted more.

    • natstowngreg - Feb 21, 2012 at 3:42 PM

      The Red Sox tried to hold the Cubs for ransom. They failed as they should have, miserably.

  6. istillbelieveinblue - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:14 PM

    Yes, this is low hanging fruit, but the Cubs also sent a case of Old Style and a bucket of KFC.

    • El Bravo - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:29 PM

      KFC would really be a slap in the face when they could have sent Harold’s.

    • jwbiii - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:31 PM

      The Red Sox should have held out for Goose Island and Harold’s.

  7. canowack - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:17 PM

    What a joke

  8. crispybasil - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:17 PM

    This is about what I expected. Seemed like a lot of other Sox fans were hoping that the team would send a prospect or two over in exchange for a better player, but I’m glad that didn’t happen.

    • kopy - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:35 PM

      There were a lot of “It’s Garza. Book it.” folks roaming around spreading their nonsense. I’m glad to know we don’t have to hear that crap anymore.

  9. proudlycanadian - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:21 PM

    Will the player to be named later also have a well known name? Roidger’s son might be available in a 3 way trade.

    • proudlycanadian - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:45 PM

      Carpenter and Clemens for Epstein has nice optics.

    • patsandsox - Feb 21, 2012 at 2:30 PM

      It will be someone we have all never heard of. A non prospect.

      This took longer then my wife picking what to wear when we go out to dinner.

  10. drewzducks - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:29 PM

    This reminds me of Geraldo Rivera and Al Capone’s vault. Lots of build up and an empty result.

  11. jason1214 - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:32 PM

    Wow, C.Carpenter is SO significant (eye roll)…I told you so Sox fans…

  12. xpensivewinos - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:35 PM

    Red Sox have no one to blame but themselves. They had all the leverage and lost it the second they let Epstein walk before making a “trade” first. He should never have been allowed to leave until compensation had been established.

    I was half-expecting it to be Shawon Dunston since the Red Sox don’t have a shortstop…….

    It’s going to be a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong year in Boston.

    • Ari Collins - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:04 PM

      About 93 wins long, sure.

    • tone360 - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:40 PM

      Unheard of, didn’t see the reasoning.

  13. jason1214 - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:36 PM

    Gosh, where did all those Sox fans go, that told me it would be Castro, Garza, etc???…..

    • baseballisboring - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:10 PM

      They probably don’t exist, you probably saw like one person on a site with a lot of stupid baseball fans like ESPN say that, and you just enjoy thinking it was all of us.

      • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:36 PM

        There was at least one commenter here that came to that conclusion. And he put his thoughts on it down in a very long and orderly manner. He acknowledged there was no way it was going to be Castro, but seemed pretty sure it was going to be Garza.

      • baseballisboring - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:44 PM

        Sure it was a Sox fan?

      • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:54 PM

        About 98%.

      • baseballisboring - Feb 21, 2012 at 3:07 PM

        Translation: I assumed, cause it’s more fun.

      • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 4:37 PM

        Actual translation: The commenter didn’t expressly say he is a Sox fan, but made hints through his comments.

        Maybe don’t be a dick next time?

      • baseballisboring - Feb 21, 2012 at 4:57 PM

        Still, one guy, who cares? I was mostly just taking issue with the first comment I responded to…I mean hey, I’m a Sox fan. And that makes me a little biased, like everyone is to their respective teams and fanbases. But being that I’m a Sox fan, and also spend too much time on sites like these, I have lots of interaction with Sox fans and there has not been any sort of uproar, nor was there ever any general expectation that the Theo thing was gonna yield someone like Garza or Castro. I understand people are gonna shit on Sox/Yankees/Phillies fans, and that’s OK. But shit on us for the right reasons at least, don’t just make stuff up to be a dick.

      • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 6:14 PM

        I was really just saying that the truth is somewhere in the middle of none and a lot of Sox fans that were expecting a star player. I do know that the first commenter was on that particular post talking with the guy who I referred to earlier.

    • homelanddefense - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:54 PM

      there werent a ton of us on here saying that. There was def one or two guys but dont make it seem like all of us were.

  14. bigharold - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:37 PM

    This is about right and everybody except card carrying members of the Nation will see it as such.

    As for the Nation, … let the howling begin!!

    • thinman61 - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:45 PM

      No howling. Sounds about right to me too. At least it’s over.

    • Ari Collins - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:24 PM

      Yep. Chris Carpenter is a relief prospect with some upside as a quality reliever or a back of the rotation starter. Sounds about right to me.

      • patsandsox - Feb 21, 2012 at 2:33 PM

        I agree with Ari. I think its a good deal and time to move on. Actualy way past time to move on. Hes a lefty also which is always a good thing

      • Ari Collins - Feb 21, 2012 at 3:06 PM

        Carpenter’s a righty.

      • patsandsox - Feb 21, 2012 at 3:27 PM

        Man I have to proof read better my bad

    • baseballisboring - Feb 21, 2012 at 3:13 PM

      Yeah, I had some foolish hope we might be able to wrangle Cashner from them or something, but I’m not upset over this, seems to be about the going rate.

  15. Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:39 PM

    It’s not over yet. I wonder if the PTBNL is going to be Baez (last year’s first pick). He didn’t sign until 8/15/11 so I don’t think he can be traded for a year (or is it 6 months? I don’t remember and can’t seem to find it online).

    If it isn’t Baez then this is less than I though it would be. I thought it would be Jackson and/or McNutt.

    bigleagues (if you’re reading this)- Turns out we were both way off the mark. I bet you’re a little more surprised than I am, however.

    • paperlions - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:46 PM

      I very seriously doubt it. There has never been significant compensation given in exchange for allowing managers/FO people leave for other teams. Usually, a couple of C prospects…a B- if the team is lucky. If a team values a guy that much….just don’t allow him to interview….if you say “yes”, thereby saying that you are okay if a guy under contract leaves (even in a lateral move)….it’s hard to argue that you think he was highly valuable after the fact.

      • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:01 PM

        I doubt it too. See below about me just wondering out loaud because a PTBNL seems odd to me. Baez would be too much.

        I agree. I never thought anyone saying it was going to be some type of world beating price was being realistic.

    • tone360 - Feb 21, 2012 at 3:32 PM

      PTBNL… Alfonso Soriano. Please lord.

  16. jason1214 - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:44 PM

    @Alex k
    Its not gonna be Baez, keep dreaming.

    • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:57 PM

      Keep dreaming? I’m a Cubs fan. I don’t want it to be Baez.

      I was just wondering out loud because a PTBNL seems odd in a deal like this.

      • Francisco (FC) - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:14 PM

        PTBNL doesn’t mean the team gaining a player picks whatever they like. The team sending the PTBNL will make up a list (usually C prospect or less) and the other team gets to pick one from that list. The Cubs will control who goes on the list, no biggie.

      • jwbiii - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:30 PM

        The other thing this could mean is that they have agreed on the player, but the Cubs can’t trade him until a year after he signed his first pro contract. So a 2011 draftee or a recent international signee.

      • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:31 PM

        FC- I know how PTBNL stuff works (this is not meant to be said in a shitty way, just letting you know). It just seems odd for an offseason deal. I was wondering out loud if there could have been an agreement that it is Baez but he can’t be traded yet so they have him as a PTBNL. I don’t think that is going to be the case, just spitballing.

      • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:42 PM

        jwbiii- This is exactly what I mean. If I’m crazy for thinking it, at least I’m not alone. I don’t think it’s going to be any big time prospect, but there is always the chance. I feel like I just need to prep myself for the possibility that it’s going to be Baez (which should make it all the sweeter when it isn’t!).

  17. Old Gator - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:49 PM

    Epstein isn’t going to help the Cubs immediately, so I guess it makes sense that the Beanbags receive a player who won’t help them much immediately either.

    • comeonnowguys - Feb 21, 2012 at 12:57 PM

      What are you talking about? He’s helping them right now. The effects, however, will take a few years.

      • Old Gator - Feb 21, 2012 at 2:39 PM

        Um…okay. But we’re both saying the same thing. You prefer to be explicit. I prefer to be parabolic. That way, I get to write off more mileage expense on my metaphors.

  18. Ari Collins - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:09 PM

    For those asking about the PTBNLs, they’re likely nobody, as the only reason they were included is to make it officially a player trade.

  19. skeleteeth - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:21 PM

    Could not care less about any of this.

  20. jason1214 - Feb 21, 2012 at 1:58 PM

    @Alex k
    Well rest assured, it wont be Baez. Red Sox obtained most significant piece in Carpenter.

    • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 2:57 PM

      That’s most likely true. But I’ll feel a lot better when the Cubs or Red Sox tell me it isn’t Baez.

      • jason1214 - Feb 21, 2012 at 7:01 PM

        Can’t be Baez, Alex, they have until April 15 to settle PTBNL, and MLB rules prohibit trading of draft picks until one calender year has passed from date of draft.

      • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 7:20 PM

        Are you sure? Do they have to have an agreement by April 15th, or do they have to have to players traded by April 15th? I’m not saying you’re wrong, just asking the question.

      • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 7:22 PM

        Just to clarify, it’s not the date of the draft it’s the date that they signed their contract. So Baez can’t be traded until 8/15/12.

  21. chiadam - Feb 21, 2012 at 2:48 PM

    This never should have taken as long as it did. Agree on compensation before making the move.

  22. WhenMattStairsIsKing - Feb 21, 2012 at 3:43 PM

    Wait…Theo isn’t the Boston GM anymore? Is Dallas Green still the Cubs GM? I hope Zimmer can turn this thing around.

  23. bigleagues - Feb 21, 2012 at 5:02 PM

    I was wrong.

    Carpenter more ‘significant’ than many of the other names bandied about however. At least he has had a cup of coffee. We’ll see what remains to happen. Probably not much, but Cherington is being his trademark coy.

    • jason1214 - Feb 21, 2012 at 7:03 PM

      I’d guess swap of low level ML’s. Can’t be 2011 picks because PTBNL have to be settled by April 15th.

    • Alex K - Feb 21, 2012 at 7:19 PM

      Everyone was wrong. You’re not alone in that department.

      • jason1214 - Feb 21, 2012 at 8:51 PM

        IN regards to your previous comment, Bos/Chi have agreed to PTBNL swap no later than April 15th, per reports.

      • bigleagues - Feb 23, 2012 at 1:29 AM

        Thank you. Except I wrote about 15 essay long posts & follow-ups last week that contained the name Garza because the longer this went on, the more likely it seemed the Cubs were trying to save face by having the Commissioner settle it . . . and then trumpeted that the Commissioner (and this was ‘reported’) could be looking to set some new precedent to dissuade executive poaching.

        So basically lotsa swings and misses to ‘earn’ an 0-fer-5. Gonna sit out a game or two and get my head back together,

        Over-swinging too much. Gotto shorten it up and stay within my game. Take nice solid cuts when its in my wheelhouse.

        Gonna stay back, be selective, balanced & wait for my pitch and just try to put good wood on it.

        I’m gonna focus on just making solid contact and let the long balls come. No more swinging for the fences.

        Except for the Hanley/Beckett theory that I tossed out there the next day. That one I’m sticking to!

  24. jason1214 - Feb 23, 2012 at 11:52 AM

    Its ok bigleagues,
    Speculation is fun, we all make outlandish comments that are later wrong. Thats why its fun.

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