Seriously, learn to Google and fact check before you spout off…it’s much better to keep your mouth shut and leave it up in the air as to whether you are a flaming dipshit than it is to open said mouth and remove all doubt.

Sop run along and lick a window or do whatever it is a moron like you does every day =P

But at least he was man enough to come clean, fess up and ask for forgiveness…unlike Big Sloppy, Palmeiro, McGwire, Bonds, Sosa etc…

The scum or the bag.

That makes a ton of sense. 4chan would have found that hilarious.

Is Julian Assange still kickin in Swaziland?

You are right in so many ways about your critique of my being negligent.

I am aware of the “greenies” used in previous generations, and til about 7 years ago. I am aware of corked bats, scuffed balls, and spitballs. No college kid in the country can throw a splitter, which is the only thing “spit” is good for. We used aluminum bats, so you couldn’t cork them. Scuffed balls…by the 4th inning, all our balls were scuffed. We didn’t have the luxury of using a few dozen per game. So, to me, steroids / HGH are in a different league. No one I played with took HGH. Steroids were rampant. I played Florida community college ball in 2000, and 3 years at one of the big 3 Florida schools. Roids were rampant. At the community college, 40% of the guys did it. At the University, only 25% did them. I was complicit. I hated it, but no good could come of ratting out 10 guys on a 24 man roster. It wouldn’t have resulted in a drug test, or suspensions, or expulsions. I chastised the guys who did it, but it was like telling someone not to practice, or lift weights. It was accepted, but not wholeheartedly, and not by everyone. The coaches had to have known. Players were so open about it.

Amphetamines…..mmmmhhhhh. I never took them. It wakes guys up. 3 mountain dews would have done the same thing. Lots of my classmates took Ridalin to stay awake to study for tests. Ultimately, it was cheating, but not like stealing an exam or banging the prof. Corked bat, scuffed ball, spitball, are all cheating, but you can get caught for them. When Belle and Sosa got caught with corked bats, that was when I realized Roids went beyond the college level. Here were 2 pro athletes cheating at the only way they could be caught. It was cheating, but guys could only do it every once in a while….a few pitches a game, a few at bats per week, or they would be caught and disciplined.

Steroids was different. It was undetectable with no testing. It didn’t only help with home runs. If a guy can now hit a ball 470 ft instead of 450 ft, it doesn’t just mean he is a show stopper, or a massive bomber. It means his bat is faster. If a guy has to time a 93 mph fastball from 60 feet away, he has x seconds (I don’t know exact time. Let’s call it .33 seconds). If his bat speed is improved because he cheats and uses steroids/hgh, he now has x+y seconds to react. His bat speed improved. It allows him to sit back and wait on my pitch y hundredths of a second longer than he would otherwise. He may as well make me pitch from 1,2,3,10? feet further away than I have to pitch to everyone else. It was cheating, and still is. Barry Bonds in 1991 had .33 (?) to decide and react if my fastball was a strike, if it was a curve, if it was a change up. He now has .38 (?) seconds. It is a massive advantage.

I am sure us pitchers had an advantage, otherwise Clemen’s career wouldn’t have resurrected, but I don’t know what that advantage was. Speed probably. It is much easier to throw accurately at 97% than at 100%. If someone gets the same speed, but is given the luxury of accuracy because of only having to throw 97%, I feel cheated.

I never used the stuff. If Andy Pettitte only followed Clemen’s advice 1 or 2 times, it is ashamed he ruined his career. However, I have seen PED’s used, and guys usually don’t stop once they see the results they get from it.

Married men don’t start wearing a condom again once the experience the results, and PED users are no different.

I can see it.

Clearly you are still missing the point that Len’s remarks are in the context to his facetious disdain for Posada and Jeter nothing more.

Since I’ve no reason to think otherwise, I’ll take it at face value your statement regarding your baseball pedigree.

In fact the one point you raise about some players never getting to the big leagues or never realizing their full potential because of those who decided to take PEDs was an acceptable if not at least necessary practice regardless of its legality or moral correctness. To me that is probably the only truly disturbing part of what surely will eventually come to be known as the steroid era. But, to keep things in perspective there have always been aspects of “cheating” in baseball that weren’t fair either starting with amphetamines. If you’ve read nothing but Jim Bouton’s ball four you know that they were institutionalized in baseball going back to at least the 50s. Or, scuffing balls, hell Don “Black and Decker” Sutton was renowned for scuffing balls and he’s in the HOF despite his reputation. The Giants supposedly beat the Dodger’s in 54 by stealing signs from center field and corking bats goes back to the 20’s. Not to mention segregation that didn’t change until 47. This is just one more facet of a long history or cheating or gamesmen ship that has occurred during baseball’s history. In time PEDs will be viewed that way too.

“I wasn’t willing to sacrifice my morals, my integrity, and most importantly my health to stay ahead of cheaters.”

Yet at the same time you, and every other player in college, the minors and MLB choose to ignore the fact that PED use was not only happening but was rampant and growing. Frankly that undermines any moral superiority. It would not have been possible for PEDs to become widespread unless players looked the other way and to date not one has once made an issue out of it, .. not in college or the pros. I’m not even talking about outing players, nobody has so much gone public and admitted that it happened, still does and needs to be eradicated. Not a nobody toiling in AA or a mega star with a 7 year guaranteed contract. Players knew first and did nothing. Eventually the teams knew, the media then the fans. The teams the media and the fans could only speculate but the players KNEW, they had to because you can’t live and play baseball together and not know, .. yet they did nothing. You even state;

“I saw many inferior athletes become superior because of this shit.”.

I’m guessing you didn’t do a thing except get mad. I get it, .. nobody wants to be known as a rat but only the players could have stopped this before it became widespread and not one tried. So while you might be outraged I don’t think a single player has the right to complain or be morally outraged.

He wasn’t better then me.
He was better than me.

Thanks for trying though.

No. I was an average D1 player, but I played with guys who had to compete with cheaters to make a living.

I like that these cheaters are ostracised, as they should be. Pettitte for some reason isn’t, and I do not understand why he gets a pass. If his name was Andres, instead of Andrew, he would not be welcomed back with open arms by baseball fans.

” Hooray, Andy Pettitte is back. He is a True Yankee. He is the greatest post season pitcher ever”

It is so tiresome. For someone to say he is a better Yankee than a non cheater angered me.

Welcome back to one of my favorite Yankees!

So, I apologise. You aren’t drinking you’re just obnoxious. And, if you’ve an argument to make about PEDs, and or player’s skin color and how they are treated differently than I suggest you do a better job of explaining yourself rather than just make incendiary statements.

Pettitte’s cheating is overlooked, and the “better member” comment displeased me. Out of the core 4, the one I don’t want my children to emulate is the “better member”.

With their amazing rotation i can understand why
/sarcasm done

Perhaps not. Before he went o the Astros the Yankees in fact offered him more money. But, by that time he was already pissed off at the Yankees and decided to bolt.

Money is certainly part of the equation, as it should be, but with Pettitte it’s not the deciding factor.

Like drinking and driving boozing and blogging don’t mix.