Comments on: The Pirates are continuing their ridiculous Navy SEALS training of prospects

By: danaking

danaking — Thu, 25 Oct 2012 20:12:48 +0000

@Stlouis1baseball, and blacksables,
I served, and I think it’s a stupid idea for baseball players. There are a lot of les risky ways to build teamwork.

On the other hand, I agree with blacksables completely abut the cold training. i did my basic training at Fort Dix during an eight-week period where the temperature never got about 32. Early on I got in the habit of deciding, as soon as I hit the cold air, “It’s not as bad as I thought it would be.” That has carried over, and i am rarely cold now, whether I think of it or not.

A week of something like this won’t do squat for them though, except maybe bond the players in hating the SOB who thought it up.

By: chadjones27

chadjones27 — Thu, 25 Oct 2012 14:38:27 +0000

Having never served I never thought about the “mind over matter” aspect later in their careers. Great perspective. I was commenting from a “let’s all get in shape and hope we don’t atrophy in the off-season” perspective. I see your point.

By: bh192012

bh192012 — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 21:54:59 +0000

Because it’s wasting ammo. Later on when I want to open a bottle of Red Stripe by shooting the top off I’ll be screwed.

By: onbucky96

onbucky96 — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 21:01:49 +0000

Wow. I blasted Apple and hs agent Satan for not signing. Now I must issue a mea culpa. To Apple, not Satan. Get a grip Pirates, you train baseball players not SEALS.

By: stlouis1baseball

stlouis1baseball — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 20:26:13 +0000

Thanks Matt! The Pirates certainly haven’t cornered the market on this sort of thing (as your post proves). Further, Kiwi stated a Rugby team used to do it (ceased doing so after a freak scorpion incident). The majority of commenters on this particular article seem to think going through a week of advanced PT suddenly makes a prospect forget to play baseball.
Again…do the PT for the week then hit the diamond the following week.
Is that so hard to grasp?

By: IdahoMariner

IdahoMariner — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 20:15:56 +0000

thank you for making sense. Well said.

I also don’t see the point of pushing them through sleep deprivation — in fact, making them perform through sleep deprivation’s effects is likely counter-productive to achieving peak physical fitness. And, it’s considered hazing in most states.

I totally endorse all minor and major league players being subject to a mandatory diet and fitness regimen — in the off-season, too — because it makes sense to expect athletes to be in top physical shape and to be able to endure the longest professional sports season….and I think teams ought to either provide good healthy food to minor and major leaguers or pay the minor leaguers enough so they can provide it for themselves…
but what the pirates are doing shouldn’t be mistaken for a physical fitness regimen. it’s a stunt, and a bad idea.

By: schlom

schlom — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 20:05:46 +0000

I think must of us realize that the reason it’s being seen as a bad idea is because the Pirates are doing it. If Joe Maddon was doing it everyone would be saying it’s genius.

By: metalhead65

metalhead65 — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 19:34:05 +0000

to you obummer fans saying this training is all the gop fault,hey maybe the pirates decided to try something different after years of doing it the democratic way. you know doing the same thing over and over and with the same losing results? maybe they decided the democratic ways of telling batters not to worry about striking out and that it is ok to make errors and it was ok for pitchers to leave balls over the plate for hitters to hit as long as they gave it their best effort was not working. maybe the pirates decided that making players work hard and be accountable for their pay was a better way than to have everything handed to them.maybe waking them up in the middle of the night was better than asking them if it was ok for them to get up at 10 in the morning for breakfast and if they felt like to maybe play some baseball after.you know the way the democratic and liberal way of doing things.

By: Matt Bandi

Matt Bandi — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 18:37:23 +0000

Regardless of whether the training should be considered a good idea, can we at least stop acting like Pirates prospects are the only athletes that have ever done something like this? There are tons of other teams/athletes that have tried it, with mostly positive reviews. For some reason, it’s only stupid for the Pirates to do it.

http://video.msnbc.msn.com/nightly-news/48327879#48327879

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/olympics/story/2012-04-16/navy-seals-olympics/54506732/1

http://espn.go.com/espnw/news-opinion/6644159/training-max-navy-seals

http://www.wgrz.com/sports/article/174161/4/Sabres-Train-With-Navy-Seals-

http://www.baseballnews.com/features/stories/navysealtraining.htm

http://www2.teamusa.org/USA-Field-Hockey/Features/2012/April/25/Navy-SEALs-push-US-Olympians-to-their-limits-in-training.aspx

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/26283066/31975211

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7987071/michigan-wolverines-take-leadership-training-road

http://espn.go.com/blog/playbook/trending/post/_/id/9116/maryland-team-trains-with-navy-seals

http://www.post-gazette.com/stories/sports/penguins/penguins-win-drill-instructors-praise-at-west-point-boot-camp-452165/

By: schlom

schlom — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 18:32:50 +0000

I think people are missing the fact that doing stuff like this is really, really, fun. I’m sure that’s why they are doing this instead of just exclusively the normal workout stuff

By: fmlizard

fmlizard — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 17:54:17 +0000

Mark Appel is in an air-conditioned classroom in Palo Alto feeling pretty good about his choices right about now.

By: blacksables

blacksables — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 17:07:25 +0000

Hoo rah.

By: stex52

stex52 — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:54:26 +0000

This ^

By: stlouis1baseball

stlouis1baseball — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:53:40 +0000

Blacksables: “When I was in the Army”
Missippimusicman: “As a former active duty Marine”

So you think just maybe there is a correlation between the three of us who have served being in pro “PT…Hell Week” camp versus the 475 other posters who haven’t served being against it?
Coincidence? I think not.

By: paperlions

paperlions — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:52:54 +0000

It actually seems like military training teaches you to take responsibility for things you are told to take responsibility for…because it sure as hell doesn’t result in those responsible being accountable and does result in those told to execute orders taking full responsibility for the results.

Given how rampant rape of fellow soldiers is in the military, it sure doesn’t seem that the “making good decisions thing” is working very well either.

By: stex52

stex52 — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:52:04 +0000

“saurischian” sigh

By: stex52

stex52 — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:51:02 +0000

From a Sauischian point of view, who can argue? That pretty much turned out the lights for them.

By: paperlions

paperlions — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:42:59 +0000

Doing this training for a few days likely does nothing for the “physical shape” of young athletes….who are generally already in great shape.

By: Old Gator

Old Gator — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:38:30 +0000

The question is, once they've been brutalized into a state of acute physical excellence, where are they going to finish?

By: anvil35

anvil35 — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:33:22 +0000

I agree with Mississippi and blacksables – this teaches discipline, teamwork and individual resourcefulness not just developing the body physically. This sort of training pushes limits and getting the most out of a persons body – both mentally and physically. Maybe Mr. Calcaterra ought to grab a short telephone pole and do some shoulder presses and situps hugging that thing…He might write better articles. Maybe you can get some more of you colleagues to join you…

By: mfortuna45

mfortuna45 — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:26:42 +0000

Of course I’m familiar with the difference between Major Leagues and the Instructional Leagues. This news just so happened to break while the Pirates were in the middle of a collapse at the Major League level. The writer’s point? Look how inept the Pirates are. They are in the middle of a big collapse and lack fundamentals at the Major League level and are putting their prospects through Navy SEALS training instead of teaching them fundamentals that are lacking in the majors.

Like I said, if the Pirates won the Central or took one of the Wild Card spots this would be a non-story.

By: mississippimusicman

mississippimusicman — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 16:19:55 +0000

As a former active duty Marine (no such thing as an ex-Marine, guys), I have to say that there are benefits to this type of training that people are overlooking. Phone pole drills aren’t just about carrying something heavy, they teach teamwork. As blacksables points out above, it’s not just about physical conditioning, although it’s great for that – it’s about building confidence that your body can take more than you gave it credit for.

By: mgdsquiggy17

mgdsquiggy17 — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 15:54:14 +0000

Just because fitness isn’t paramount or absolutely necessary to having a successful career being in great shape surely will help you more then if you weren’t. Most guys that are successful despite being fit just have a natural ability or talent that the majority of players don’t possess. However for the rest that need to work their ass off to have a chance at making it I don’t think it’s an awful idea. Baseball is a long season and I have no problem with the Pirates trying to use an outside the box idea to making sure their players are at their peak fitness wise.

By: blacksables

blacksables — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 15:53:30 +0000

You are familiar with the difference between the Major Leagues and the Instructional Leagues, aren’t you?

By: blacksables

blacksables — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 15:51:43 +0000

No, military training teached you to be disciplined, think for yourelf, and make good decisions, and then accept the responsibility for them if you make a mistake.

I can see how you got confused, seeing as how you have never served. Not your fault, not everyone has the cojones to do it.

By: paperlions

paperlions — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 15:50:14 +0000

stl1b:

This type of activity has no more benefit to baseball prospects than it would for a group of CPAs. While the exercise itself may be beneficial to any group, it will not improve the ability of a person to play baseball or be an accountant. Because there is no upside, the best you can do is waste time….the worst you can do is inhibit the development of baseball (or CPA) skills due to injuries that require surgery and/or rehab.

I’d love to see a single argument in FAVOR of this stupidity (because there hasn’t been one given)…and if you use the ability to invade a poorly defended foreign country (or baseball team territory) I will discount your answer.

By: blacksables

blacksables — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 15:44:17 +0000

When I was in the Army in Germany, we used to do cold weather training the way the Russian Spetznatz did it. Wait until the the coldest day we were going to get, with snow and ice on the ground, and then go out in the middle of the night, strip naked, and stay like that as long as we could.

Before I did, I thought it was pretty stupid and didn’t see the point. But after 15 minutes of freezing my ass off, once I started to put my clothes on, I wasn’t really that cold any more. And to this day, have never been affected by the cold like other people. Because now I know how much it worse it can be standing out there naked than walking around at 0 bundled up in coats, gloves, and scarves.

Once those Pirate players are done with this kind of training, and know how tough it is, I’ll bet they won’t complain nearly as much about an extra round of fielding drills, or playing a day game after a night game, or the summer heat. They’ll know there is much worse, and they’ve conquered it.

It makes a tremendous difference in the mindset of a person.

Cause and effect. Just because some individuals don’t want to try doesn’t mean it’s wrong.

By: paperlions

paperlions — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 15:43:45 +0000

They couldn’t be any worse at that than they are at baseball….could they?

By: ezthinking

ezthinking — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 15:43:34 +0000

Yes, and some other dipshit exec would want to use it for Mike Trout or Bryce Harper.

By: ezthinking

ezthinking — Wed, 24 Oct 2012 15:41:21 +0000

Military training teaches soldiers to follow orders – not necessarily be the most intelligent they can be. That is not necessarily “peak mental shape” rather places them in the required mental state for military service. Nothing wrong with that, just useless for baseball.