Comments on: Congrats, you’re fired: Winning the Manager of the Year award isn’t always such a good thing

By: illcomm

illcomm — Tue, 13 Nov 2012 19:00:03 +0000

why was this article reran??????

By: MotorCitySteel

MotorCitySteel — Tue, 13 Nov 2012 18:30:52 +0000

I hope Jim Leyland wins. I am grateful for what he has done in the past. But over the last couple of years, the team talent has overcome his poor decisions. Time to move on. Thanks for some great years Jim! Just being honest, even Sparky had a shelf life.

By: pjmarn6

pjmarn6 — Tue, 13 Nov 2012 15:33:52 +0000

You can’t fire the players with guaranteed contracts so take it out on the managers who have relatively cheap contracts.

By: joeflaccosunibrow

joeflaccosunibrow — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 21:16:44 +0000

In 1997, Davey Johnson won it and what is fired the same day he won the award.

I love Peter Angelos

By: indaburg

indaburg — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:51:33 +0000

While I agree that managers get too much blame when things go wrong and vice versa, I think forsch31 has a point. It’s a little more complicated than just simply filling out a line-up card and managing the bullpen. If it were that simple, heck, any one of us could be baseball managers.

Last year, I was forced to take a “Manager University” course by corporate. Of course, it wasn’t about baseball managers–that would have been actually interesting. I spent most of the classes wondering how these management tactics could apply in the baseball world. Most of it was bullshit, but the one thing that stuck is that good managers, whether in baseball or in real life, know how to place people in the best possible position to succeed then get out of the way. Maddon’s a wiz at this. A great example is Bochy’s usage of Lincecum in the post-season. Of course, Lincecum had to execute, but by using him as a “super-closer” instead of a starter, he placed Lincecum in a position to succeed. Any managers who use a platoon for a position are also applying that philosophy.

By: roverkarlthecannedham

roverkarlthecannedham — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:28:56 +0000

This I like. To it, if it is not too presumptuous of me, I would like to add

D. B. B. V.

Don’t – Do Not Under Any Circumstances
Be – Engage In, Act Like, Or Channel By Demonic Possession
Bobby – Bobby
Valentine – Horses Ass

By: indaburg

indaburg — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:25:48 +0000

Don’t forget–coffee’s for closers only.

By: indaburg

indaburg — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:23:31 +0000

Some bosses just have no respect for priorities.

By: churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged

churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:18:52 +0000

What’s your name?

By: stex52

stex52 — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:13:58 +0000

They are professionals getting tons of money. If they need too much babying, get someone else. It won’t work anyway in the long run.(See: Red Sox, Josh Hamilton, Carlos Zambrano, etc., etc., Etc.)

By: Francisco (FC)

Francisco (FC) — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:01:43 +0000

As opposed to the rear-end position many of these managers found themselves in?

By: The Dangerous Mabry

The Dangerous Mabry — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 19:01:28 +0000

I think there’s real potential for managerial advice in that Glengarry scene…

A. B. C.

A- Always.
B- Baby.
C- Closers.

Always Baby Closers.

A. I. D. A.
Attitude – Does this guy have a closer’s attitude?
Inning – Is it the ninth inning?
Deficit – Are you winning by three or fewer runs?
Action – Get that closer in there!

By: Old Gator

Old Gator — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 18:49:12 +0000

Of course the example of Girardi with the Feesh was an extraordinary one. Girardi figured out a few weeks into his tenure that he was working for a putz, and proceeded to treat him like one. Scrooge McLoria has, you may have noticed, fired managers for less.

By: forsch31

forsch31 — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 18:47:19 +0000

Well, there’s a little more than that. The primary job of the manager is to manage the personalities in the locker room and in the field to try to get the best performance out of his players. That’s a hard thing to quantify, sorta like evaluating how a catcher handles a pitching staff.

By: mianfr

mianfr — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 18:22:37 +0000

Which is ok at times, but on the whole it’s probably best to consider environment as well. Doesn’t it look like Terry Francona had a much harder team to manage than, say, the Ron Gardenhire did?

By: mianfr

mianfr — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 18:21:24 +0000

It’s usually becomes writers need an explanation for why some team vastly overperformed its run differential and give too much credit to the manager, and then when the luck returns to normal they blame him for doing a bad job of managing the same team as before.

By: stex52

stex52 — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 17:41:44 +0000

No problem. The more the merrier. If we sell this point long enough, maybe more people will come to our position on managers.

By: paperlions

paperlions — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 17:31:42 +0000

Freaking boss interrupting my important blog comments…making me look like some Johnny-come-lately.

By: paperlions

paperlions — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 17:25:58 +0000

I have a theory that would explain this.

Manager of the year winners are typically in charge of teams that perform above expectations. Often (but not always), such teams just got a little lucky, a couple guys had career years, etc. Then, when those teams go back to being exactly what they were the entire time, the manager is blamed because the expectation level is now set at an unreasonable level, as if the outlier year somehow represented a new talent level on the team, resulting in the manager being shown the door.

By: deepstblu

deepstblu — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 17:25:39 +0000

I think you got it in one. The Revenge of Pythagoras.

By: missthemexpos

missthemexpos — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 17:14:58 +0000

Former “Manager Of The Year” winners should receive “The What Have You Done For Me Lately” award when they get fired a few years later.

By: rollinghighwayblues

rollinghighwayblues — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 17:09:11 +0000

Thank you. At least someone gets it. Managers get way too much credit/blame. Show up, fill out a lineup card, hit fungo, and try your best at managing the bullpen.

By: The Common Man

The Common Man — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 17:06:13 +0000

That would be my assumption too, Aaron. Teams outperform and then regress and the manager gets the blame because his mojo stopped working. We tend not to reward sustained success as much as we do out of nowhere seasons, especially because the assumption is that a new(ish) manger is the reason things turned around.

By: sabathiawouldbegoodattheeighthtoo

sabathiawouldbegoodattheeighthtoo — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 17:04:44 +0000

I think manager evaluation in MLB is all about performance relative to expectations. If a team was supposed to be crappy, and they aren’t, the manager did a great job. If the following season the team fails to improve further, the manager failed.

It will be interesting to see how the Orioles react if the team plays pretty well but misses the playoffs in 2013. That would have been a welcome result in spring 2012, but now will probably be seen as a disappointment.

By: stex52

stex52 — Mon, 12 Nov 2012 17:03:51 +0000

Most likely the fact that the manager really only has two important jobs: manage the bullpen arms and keep out of the way. So if a team overperforms he gets too much credit; if they underperform they get too much blame. You have obvious walking disaster areas like Valentine or Cecil Cooper, but generally the team decides how well they do.