Comments on: OK, forget what I said about Bonds and Clemens maybe getting in the Hall after all

By: cur68

cur68 — Sun, 02 Dec 2012 02:13:10 +0000

pj: You must be new here or this is an epic, epic reading fail.
Can you show us all where Craig said the things you are claiming he said? I’d love to see that.

Insofar as I can tell his position is: The HOF has already admitted cheaters and people of poor moral character. PED use is, in many respects, much LESS worse than some of the other stuff people who are in the HOF have gotten away with. Bonds & Clemens were the best of their generation. They did no more than many, many, many other HOFers in order to win and they fell well short of what some in the hall have got up to. Even leaving aside the “Steroid Years” of both players, they had HOF careers. Neither has ever been suspended for a failed drug test or officially censured in any way by MLB. They deserve to be in the HOF.

Nothing in the above article gainsays that. It is rather a re-think on his previous article that Bonds & Clemens might get in after all because a few writers seemed to have softened their stance. In fact it appears the sentiment of the writers is the exact opposite of what Craig thought, hence this piece explaining that he might have been wrong thinking Bonds & Clemens would get in. He isn’t changing his opinion of IF they should get in but rather WILL THEY get in.

As for the whole “Hall of Shame” screed; well what is it with the likes of Cobb & Yawkey in it? “The Hall of Asshole Women Beating Racists & Child Molester Enablers Who Had Stuff To Do With Baseball”?

I award you no thumbs up. I award you my first thumb click down in a month.

Good Day.

By: pjmarn6

pjmarn6 — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 23:44:18 +0000

Okay Craig Calcaterra gave his opinion that Baseball’s Hall of Fame should be changed to the Hall of Shame in order to let in cheats. Then he wrote an article half taking that back. Now when he KNOWS that cheating is not being condoned by the baseball writers who vote for the players he does a back flip and states ooooopppppsssss. In other words he doesn’t want to maintain his position.

Craig if you had your articles ghost written (I am sure that you would be hard put to find someone so absolutely wrong to write them) and you received a raise or award for the ghost written stories would you return the overpayments and return the award?

What difference is there if you cheated or the drug users cheated? In my businesses, we bend over backwards to make the clients come back and use our services and buy our products. We “KNOW” how important it is to make clients who come back and spend money with us. We could not exist without repeat customers. If we were to start cheating out customers, we would soon be out of business. But “YOU” say the baseball players who cheated to get higher salaries should also be singled out and award more awards because they cheated. Really are your morals and ethics that fucked up that is how you think and that is what you believe?

By: jayscarpa

jayscarpa — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 21:46:49 +0000

By the time I’ve gotten to the bottom of the page I’ve forgotten most of what you’ve written – so no worries.

By: joshtown81

joshtown81 — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 19:45:18 +0000

I’m 31, and grew up with Bonds, Clemens, etc just being utterly dominant. I get your argument Craig, in that well, these guys weren’t really cheating, because it wasn’t illegal. So if a lot of players were doing, it sort of levels the playing field back out. But what I DO have a problem is both of them continuing to thumb their noses at the game, almost in defiance, when overwhelming evidence seems to point to their guilt. I feel like argument of “well they were in before-hand” holds some water, but this “holier-than-thou” thing they have going is a real turn off. Coming clean goes a long way in getting back into peoples good graces, and I think it would do both of them a world of good.

By: noozehound

noozehound — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 16:01:11 +0000

all you’re saying is that YOU want a vote. a no talent blogger who just bitches and whines but has an over inflated ego and thinks he’s a real journalist.

By: indaburg

indaburg — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 15:32:21 +0000

LOL That would been much funnier. Gotta love Monty Python.

By: csilojohnson

csilojohnson — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 14:58:29 +0000

Coffee is more damaging then some of these PEDS being used. Unless were talking decaf here.

By: csilojohnson

csilojohnson — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 14:56:29 +0000

Baseball* Football* Cycling* Golf* Patriots*
Why are they fighting the status quo?

By: historiophiliac

historiophiliac — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 14:49:27 +0000

I was expecting you to say “the Spanish Inquisition.”

By: historiophiliac

historiophiliac — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 14:46:41 +0000

It took forever to get my dad to give up his percolator. Even now,he has an automatic drip but refuses to use the timer feature because the coffee will get stale overnight. The fresher the sludge for him, the better. For example, there was that time he went to Switzerland on business….suffice to say, after the first day, they brought his coffee in a big cup. And, he draws the line at a press (I don’t think I disagree with him there).

I like leaded and unleaded myself.

By: historiophiliac

historiophiliac — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 14:38:53 +0000

What? Kahlua.

By: historiophiliac

historiophiliac — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 14:35:20 +0000

Judging from Hamy’s experience this year, they are okay with the caffeine used injudiciously.

By: indaburg

indaburg — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 13:20:55 +0000

Camping is a different animal. No one is expecting haute cuisine.

By: indaburg

indaburg — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 12:50:12 +0000

Half the people in the hall are cheats. Should we kick them out?

By: indaburg

indaburg — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 12:46:05 +0000

My mom (who always called American coffee “agua sucia”) gave me my first cup at age 5, not unusual among old school Latinos. First thing she taught me: do not boil the coffee.

What’s baseball’s stance on caffeine as a PED? I’ve gotten some of my best workouts after caffeine usage.

By: Old Gator

Old Gator — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 05:54:25 +0000

Coffee people are getting as obnoxious as wine people.

By: Old Gator

Old Gator — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 05:53:43 +0000

We’re not discussing juice here. We’re discussing coffee.

Anyway, if it isn’t acai, I don’t drink juice. It screws with my PH.

By: Old Gator

Old Gator — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 05:52:14 +0000

When was the last time you made coffee while you were out camping? The trick is to use bear piss instead of creek water.

By: brewcrewfan54

brewcrewfan54 — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 05:32:20 +0000

Coffee sucks. In general.

By: lostsok

lostsok — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 04:47:43 +0000

Wow. Boiled coffee has more of a chance at the hall than Clemens or Bonds.

I demand an * by boiled coffee!

By: philliesblow

philliesblow — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 04:24:08 +0000

I wonder what the reaction would be if Bonds, Clemens, etc failed to get even 5% to stay on the ballot. Don’t think it isn’t possible. Sounds like most writers don’t want them in on the first ballot as a slap on the wrist, but I’m sure they think enough will vote for them to stay on.

In 2001, a player worthy of much HOF consideration dropped off in his first year because nearly all the writers assumed others would vote for him but they didn’t consider him a 1st ballot player.

http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/post/_/id/7503/the-bbwaas-worst-mistake
http://www.baseball-reference.com/blog/archives/8856

By: coloradothistle

coloradothistle — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 03:39:57 +0000

Coffee pot? Leaded or unleaded?

By: hojo20

hojo20 — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 03:21:38 +0000

Way back in the day? I perked a pot on Sunday.

By: cackalackyank

cackalackyank — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 02:38:22 +0000

Ok so I guess they will get the 5% to stay on….

By: historiophiliac

historiophiliac — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 01:40:12 +0000

Hey, what’s with all the perco-haters on here? That’s how I make coffee when I go camping. It’s better than some Sanka bullshit.

By: indaburg

indaburg — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 01:28:13 +0000

What sanctimonious pricks. Like Jenkins from the SF Chronicle said, it’s too late to turn Cooperstown into a church. These guys were the best of their era and they belong in the hall.

P.S. Boiled coffee tastes like Starbucks. Bitter, bad coffee.

By: baloneyjohn

baloneyjohn — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 01:07:11 +0000

These guys are cheats. Whats so hard to see that.
Keep them out

By: dinklespiel

dinklespiel — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 01:07:00 +0000

And meanwhile the best player of all, Pete Rose, has to sit it out while the cheaters of the game get considered for induction.

Shame on baseball.

By: scotttheskeptic

scotttheskeptic — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 00:54:31 +0000

@Charlutes, agree to a point. Craig articulated the other day what has been crawling around my brain – these guys were good. Good enough on talent to be HoF, so vote them in – eventually. Clemens durability without substances especially clouds my mind. The plaques should note any and all questions about career statistics, ya know, being a museum.

By: paperlions

paperlions — Sat, 01 Dec 2012 00:46:55 +0000

Exactly. Even a coffee sock >>>>>>>>>>> percolator. Anything that gets the water to 200F + is bad at making coffee.