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The Mariners will be the first team to fly a Gay Pride Flag at a game this Sunday

Jun 26, 2013, 5:07 PM EDT

Pride Flag

It’s the time of the year when many cities hold their Pride parade and festivals, and Seattle’s honorary Pride parade is going on this Sunday. In honor of it the Seattle Mariners are going to raise the Pride Flag. They’ll be the first-ever baseball team to do so at a game. From Seattle Out & Proud:

While the Mariners play against the Chicago Cubs on Sunday June 30, Safeco Field will fly the rainbow Pride flag, making Major League Baseball history as the first MLB Team to publicly fly the Pride flag at a game … Rebecca Hale, Director of Public Information for the Mariners told Seattle Out & Proud this morning, “We’re a part of this community. Our fans are a reflection of our community. We thought this was an appropriate gesture on a day that is very meaningful to the LGBT community.”

This comes on the same day when, in case you hadn’t noticed, the Supreme Court issued a couple of big decisions today about gay marriage, so there is double the reason to celebrate.

If you care, my legal take on the opinions: the Defense of Marriage Act case seemed like a no-brainer Equal Protection case which the majority got right, even if it did shy away from the formalized strict-scrutiny analysis we have come to expect in Equal Protection cases. The law’s stated basis was essentially that homosexuality is wrong and icky and those people shouldn’t be able to do what other people can do. You have to make a much greater showing than that to treat one group of people differently than others under the law, and obviously no one ever bothered with that with DOMA.

The Prop 8 case from California had way weirder legal reasoning. Reasoning to do with standing that I think was erroneous and was picked up by the Court in an effort to skirt the issue of making a sweeping federal ruling about gay marriage. I feel like if they said there was standing and took it on that the Defense of Marriage Act majority may well have come to a pro-gay marriage ruling there too, but it didn’t happen. This means a good outcome but for odd legal reasons, which always makes me uncomfortable.

But yes: good outcomes. What my ex-wife and I did to marriage was way worse than anything gay people will do to it, and if they let us get married everyone should be allowed to.

But in all seriousness: People should be able to marry who they love. And I’m happy that today that is attainable for many more people than it was yesterday.

(via SBNation)

204 Comments (Feed for Comments)
  1. blaze310 - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:05 PM

    Todd Collins will be singing “its raining men” instead of taking me out to the ball game in the 7th.

    • Sideline Mob - Jul 2, 2013 at 4:20 PM

      So the Mariners fly a rectangular piece of fabric for one afternoon, and the message board here explodes with a debate on religion and politics. They flew a flag for 4 hours, and if that’s enough to make anyone go crazy, they’ve got way bigger problems than homophobia to deal with.

  2. sisisisisisisi - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:12 PM

    Will the roof be open?

  3. rgledz - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:23 PM

    First they take the word “gay” which used to just mean happy……now rainbow’s are theirs too. Rip off!

  4. thomas844 - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:35 PM

    “People should be able to marry who they love.”

    So someone marrying a sibling or a 40-year-old marrying a 14-year-old if they love each other is completely fine, is that what I’m getting?

    • Kevin S. - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:45 PM

      You understand the “consent” part of all of this, right?

    • Reflex - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:56 PM

      If siblings wish to marry each other I’m fine with that so long as they agree to not procreate. In the other case, a 14 year old is not legally able to consent, so no. Neither of these cases are the same as two consenting adult homosexuals wishing to marry, however.

    • historiophiliac - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:11 PM

      Ahh, the 18th century. Good times.

    • tablescrappy - Jun 26, 2013 at 10:47 PM

      thomas, you’re being willfully obtuse. Stop it.

    • revskip - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:53 AM

      At different points in history both of those were completely acceptable parts of “traditional marriage”.

      Jerry Lee Lewis did in fact marry his 13 year old first cousin not too long ago and she was afforded all the rights that any other marriage at the time provided.

    • jazynaz - Jun 30, 2013 at 9:14 PM

      if that’s what you’re “getting” out of what mr. calcaterra has written, then you’re not very bright. obviously, you’re not getting it at all!

  5. mudhead123 - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:35 PM

    Homosexuality is another sexual disfunction just like being born attracted to children. They don’t choose to want kids so we should accept that as well. Murders are born with a passion to kill so we should just accept it

    • Kevin S. - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:46 PM

      Funny, the people who actually make a living classifying these things rejected it as a disorder 40 years ago, long before supporting the LGBT community was politically chic.

      • Old Gator - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:34 PM

        Mudhead, you are so appropriately named – though “sludgehead” might even be more accurate.

    • sabatimus - Jun 26, 2013 at 9:34 PM

      There’s so much fallacy in this post I have no idea where to begin.

  6. cowboysoldiertx - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:36 PM

    I think it funny that the same ppl who scream “accept gays, they have the same rights and deserve respect” are also the people that make fun of me being a Christian. Its ok for others to insult my faith and say I worship a invisible wizard in the sky but if I said anything against the rainbow flag I would be a hater and a piece of shit.
    Now that I have that out of the way. No I do not support gay marriage. I never will. But the bible tells me I am to love everyone as Christ does and not to judge anyone. I follow that. If its wrong in God’s eyes HE, not me, will deal with it. I will not offer any condemnation.

    • eightyraw - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:44 PM

      First, millions of Christians support gay marriage. Second, I don’t remember Jesus saying anything like “love everyone, judge no one, but make sure to restrict rights of some.”

      • seattlej - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:59 PM

        Did Christ ever tell you to learn basic grammar and punctuation?

      • cowboysoldiertx - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:59 PM

        The bible is very firm in its stance on homosexuality. And unless you have truly delved into what is said in scripture you shouldn’t make a comment. Because what I said was spoken in certain places. So get better acquainted with the bible. But you ignored my first point… its ok for me to be insulted for my faith but HOW DARE I if I was to say insult someone’s orientation.

      • seattlej - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:01 PM

        Oops, that was supposed to be in response to the cowboy-soldier hybrid.

      • churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:19 PM

        The bible is very firm in its stance on homosexuality. And unless you have truly delved into what is said in scripture you shouldn’t make a comment.

        Is it? Can you point to the text where either Jesus and/or God said that homosexuality is wrong? Not what a prophet said, nor what a disciple said, but when they were either quoting one of the two?

        Btw, here’s a graphical representation of all the contradictions in the Bible

        http://i.imgur.com/R5BDYYZ.jpg

        its ok for me to be insulted for my faith but HOW DARE I if I was to say insult someone’s orientation.

        You choose to be one, they were born to be another. Also, you’ve had about 2000 years killing, torturing and destroying the lives of gay people. Don’t ask them to feel sorry for you because someone is calling you names.

      • eightyraw - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:23 PM

        Sorry but the Bible is not “very firm in its stance on homosexuality”. If it were, there wouldn’t be whole sects of Christianity accepting of homosexuals. I have extensively studied the Bible, and did it outside of a church. The New Testament supplants much of the tenets of the Old Testament (how many commandments do you strictly adhere to?).

        I didn’t ignore your first point. No one said that was ok. However, you were creating a straw man. It is not ok for you to not accept homosexuals and it is not ok for people to not accept that you’re a Christian. These are not conflicting in the least.

      • jshart1090 - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:41 AM

        The Bible absolutely takes a stance against homosexuality. Romans 1:18-32 for instance. The WHOLE Bible is the written word of God. The words in “red letters” are no more and no less important than any other part of scripture. And the “millions” of people that call themselves Christians aren’t adhering to the truth they proclaim they believe. There are many, many false teachers and people out there saying they’re something they’re not.

      • barrywhererufrom - Jun 27, 2013 at 9:08 AM

        Joachim and Anne, the parents of Mary. In Matthew 19:4-5, Jesus is quoted: “He answered, ‘Have you not read that He who made them from the beginning made them male and female,’ and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one’?” Christ Himself affirms marriage between one man and one woman. Again if your ‘Church’ supports gay marriage they are not following the Gospel..

    • Reflex - Jun 26, 2013 at 7:54 PM

      I’m Christian. I make fun of you for promoting views that are hostile to other human beings, not for practicing our shared faith.

    • cowboysoldiertx - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:01 PM

      Seatllej, sorry I was busy getting my ass shot at so that you could sleep safe at night to get a higher edcumacation. Please, pay for me to go back to school and you go fight in the desert.

      • seattlej - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:09 PM

        I did two tours in Iraq and one in Kosovo during my time in the Army, and somewhere along the way I still managed to respect my country by learning its primary language.

        In contrast, I’m guessing that you’re one on those guys that gets off duty and then spends hours on an Xbox or reading FHM or Maxim or some shit like that.

        This is an example of what happens when you lower the standards for enlistment.

        Also, thanks for your making assumptions about my vet status based on my education level and support for gay marriage. Oh, and thank you for your service — make sure you use those generous VA benefits to go back to grammar school.

      • eightyraw - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:29 PM

        It is noble that you enlisted. But don’t trick yourself into believing that you or anyone else in the military made it so I could sleep safely at night and go to college. You weren’t getting “your ass shot at” in America, where I reside. At best, the armed conflicts in the Middle East makes me less likely to die of a terrorist attack by something like one millionth of a percent.

      • Reflex - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:30 PM

        Nice response. I was going to discuss all the friends and family of mine who had served and realized that part of the rights they were protecting were those of homosexuals, minorities, muslims and others often bashed by right wing extremists, but I think your response is better. And thank you for your service, it is appreciated.

      • cowboysoldiertx - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:50 PM

        Actually seatllej, I don’t play video games. I race home after work to pick up my kids from daycare and school. Then I feed them, help get their homework done and make sure they have whatever they need for school. Then I either go and lead my sons cub scout den or I go and coach my sons sports. Then I rush them back home to get them into showers and bed. Then I clean house and do laundry. Of course I am not just taking care of my kids (I’m a widower) but also my sisters child because she been in a coma for 3 months. Then it starts all over again. But thank you for assuming that I am lazy.

      • Reflex - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:53 PM

        Your life remarkably resembles that of my cousin. She’s a lesbian, but really the other details are very similar. Definitely not lazy. Great mother too!

      • seattlej - Jun 26, 2013 at 9:01 PM

        And with all of those far more important things to do you still manage to find the time to honor the Internet by sharing your anonymous thoughts on gay marriage and also be a cowboy?

    • nothanksimdriving123 - Jun 26, 2013 at 11:07 PM

      Trouble is cowboy, your bible is the law only of your religion. The supreme law of our shared nation is our US Constitution and it says nothing about how our US laws should be based on anyone’s religion. And its 27 Amendments suggest a slow but sure expansion of rights for folks overlooked when it was first ratified. We’re still working on it. Come on along.

    • revskip - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:58 AM

      Pretty sure I haven’t seen anyone lose rights over their choice of religion recently. Are Christian couples who marry allowed to file joint tax returns? Are they given survivors benefits?

      Insulting gays and denying them the same rights as everyone else are not even vaguely the same thing. Same thing applies to insulting Christians and denying them their rights.

    • 18thstreet - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:57 PM

      The bible also tells you not to eat shellfish. There’s a lot of nonsense in there.
      http://biblehub.com/leviticus/11-10.htm

  7. blakeinfla - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:39 PM

    Cool, Im ok with gays flying their flag…..so when is straight day again?

    • eightyraw - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:50 PM

      Every single day

    • lifeform - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:52 PM

      Yeah! Why should underprivileged sexual minorities get all of the recognition!

      In case you haven’t noticed, in our heteronormative society, “straight day” is every day. But you stand strong, straight dude.

    • Reflex - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:56 PM

      The nice thing about the rainbow flag is that it is inclusive. It represents rights for straights as well as gays. And everyone else. It is often referred to as the ‘freedom flag’ and there is no reason that anyone who believes in freedom can not display it, doing so does not denote one as a homosexual. It stands for your rights too.

    • historiophiliac - Jun 26, 2013 at 9:49 PM

      We’re straight
      We don’t hate
      Get used to it!

  8. captcpike - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:53 PM

    Very Disappointing. I think this is very sad. Baseball is about America, apple pie, and the game. It is not about anyone’s sexual preference. What’s next??? Are we going to fly a porn flag for all the “adult entertainers” out there??? What about the Transgender flag for those that mutilate their bodies. This is baseball! Leave it that way!!!!!!!!

    • Reflex - Jun 26, 2013 at 8:57 PM

      Somewhere between 3-5% of America is homosexual. Also, homosexuality is not a preference, it is an orientation.

      • jshart1090 - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:47 AM

        Actually it is a preference and has never been proven otherwise, and never could or will be.

      • albertmn - Jun 27, 2013 at 10:16 AM

        jshart – Yep, I am sure that 3-5% of the population just “chose” to be persecuted and bullied. If it is a choice, why hasn’t that percentage risen sharply as most people (not including people like you) have grown more tolerant?

        So, if you believe it is a “choice” and it reached a point where gays were at the point of having an advantage in society, you are saying you could just quickly switch to having sex with your same gender and it wouldn’t be any different than now? If being gay is a choice, then being straight is also a choice. Seems you may be protesting a bit too much…

      • Reflex - Jun 27, 2013 at 12:16 PM

        jshart1090 – As pointed out, if its ‘just a choice’ then I challenge you to choose to be attracted to your own gender. I don’t know about you, but personally speaking I can’t find men attractive sexually no matter how hard I try. Women, on the other hand, are pretty irresistible(unless we are in Wal*Mart, ugh).

        At any rate, citation is needed because there is a massive body of evidence at this point demonstrating that homosexuality is likely genetic, and there are even some strong theories now about the driving biological reasons why.

    • eightyraw - Jun 26, 2013 at 9:06 PM

      Yep, the porn flag is next. You guessed correctly. Congrats. And thank you for you invaluable input. Comparing homosexuals to adult entertainers is just too logical to have gone unmentioned this long.

      And most of all baseball is about apple pie. The Apple Tosser throws the apple to the Apple Masher, who wields a wooden apple mutilator. Once contact is made, all the fielders race to collect apple pieces, then work together to bake a pie before the opposing team can collect a new bushel of apples. This the baseball I grew up with. Now it is all homosexuals, PEDs, and even a team in Canada! Disgusting.

    • historiophiliac - Jun 26, 2013 at 9:59 PM

      I think you need to look up “transgender.” It doesn’t have anything to do with “mutilating” your body. I’m guessing that’s a poor reference to having sex reassignment surgery — which is different than just being transgendered. Please note that “gender” and “sex” are not always interchangeable.

      • Old Gator - Jun 26, 2013 at 10:06 PM

        Certainly not at my age, anyway.

      • historiophiliac - Jun 26, 2013 at 10:15 PM

        Oh, come on. You know it’s going to be on for Gary Playa once the Body Issue comes out..with those strategically placed staples.

    • 18thstreet - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:59 PM

      People choose to be Episcopalians, and that’s protected under the law.

  9. Old Gator - Jun 26, 2013 at 9:19 PM

    Today Michelle Bachmann, poster girl for anencephaly, bon mots and demagogic grandstanding, declared that – and I quote (but I do it carefully, fully aware that passing a Michelle Bachmann thought through my own brain could be damaging) – “Marriage was created by the hand of God. No man, not even a Supreme Court, can undo what a holy God has instituted.”

    If I’m not mistaken, Pope Clement VII said pretty much the same thing to King Henry VIII.

    Ah well.

    • nothanksimdriving123 - Jun 26, 2013 at 11:16 PM

      OG, my best laugh of the day! Merci. “poster girl for anencephaly” I’m sure you meant no disrespect for those unfortunate persons actually medically afflicted.
      And FWIW, Michelle, marriage is a legal contract invented by men for the transfer of property (a woman/girl) between a father and a husband. “Holy matrimony” is whatever your religion says it is, and SCOTUS will always steer clear of that.

    • churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged - Jun 27, 2013 at 1:30 AM

      Marriage was created by the hand of God.

      I’m just curious, so one of you scholars can help me out here. Is this the marriage solely between a man and a woman? The marriage that can get dissolved after 72 days if your name is Kim Kardashian? Or how about 72 hours if your name is Britney Spears? What about he marriage between a man and his rape victim, a la the Bible? Is that the definition of marriage? Or what about Solomon and his 500 wives? What about David and his servant Bathsheba?

      • critter69 - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:36 AM

        The bibble says that Solomon had 700 wives ‘of royal birth’ and 300 concubines. No word on how many ‘non-royal’ wives he had. So you understated the number of wives Solomon had, and completely ignored the concubines. But ’500 wives’ alone seems to be a bit more than ‘one man/one woman’.

        In any event, Solomon would have been one busy dude (or just horny?) to get through all those wives and concubines in a single year!

      • jshart1090 - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:57 AM

        Marriage started with Adam and Eve and has continued since those first 2 people. So yes, God created marriage. And maybe you should read some of the examples you give. David & Soloman were both sinners, just you and I and every other person that’s lived on this earth except 1, and repented for what they did.

      • barrywhererufrom - Jun 27, 2013 at 9:10 AM

        Joachim and Anne, the parents of Mary. In Matthew 19:4-5, Jesus is quoted: “He answered, ‘Have you not read that He who made them from the beginning made them male and female,’ and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one’?” Christ Himself affirms marriage between one man and one woman.

      • historiophiliac - Jun 27, 2013 at 2:31 PM

        barry, stop quoting partial sections from that chapter — which is on divorce, btw. It closes with: “He who is able to accept it, let him accept it” and that indicates the teaching is a preference rather than a law. One’s status as a Christian does not turn on this point (even if it were relevant, which it’s not).

    • critter69 - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:45 AM

      I believe that Ancient Greece (which existed from about 600 BCE to about 600 CE had marriage, and Ancient Greece didn’t have ties to the Jewish or Xian religions until after the Xian’s jebus ‘rose into heaven’. But they had marriage, even before Ancient Greece.

      So Shelly is saying that she recognizes the gods of Ancient Greece, when marriages were arranged between families, based on how much the groom (and/or his family) could get for the bride, her apparent ability to breed and raise (preferably male) children and/or her ability to ‘contribute’ in the home (such as weaving, etc.)?

      I never thought I’d see the day when Shelly believed in some god other than her Xian doG.

  10. sisisisisisisi - Jun 26, 2013 at 9:50 PM

    IMHO, not a proper place for children. They don’t have at churches and schools.

  11. barrywhererufrom - Jun 26, 2013 at 10:19 PM

    File this under who gives a crap..lets have a team fly anything that is affiliated with something that was for the tea party…pro life movement and people’s heads would explode. Another Pc move…

    • Old Gator - Jun 26, 2013 at 11:55 PM

      And for good reason. The flags you mentioned would have been designed by and for fascists and imbeciles like yourself.

    • barrywhererufrom - Jun 27, 2013 at 6:33 AM

      Old gator calling pro life supporters facists…even for an ahole like you its a new low. I am sure you are happy that the irs targeted tea party groups. You are the facist..you support the killing of babies and the idea of lower taxes and less govt..you are part of the reason why our.country is so messed up. When you call me a facist which I am not it loses its meaning. When your govt spies on everyday citizens..when it targets reporters because they disagree with their stories that is something facist dictators.do. But again you are a moron who sees me the person who supports life and marriage as between a man and a woman as facist..

  12. realgone2 - Jun 26, 2013 at 10:21 PM

    I got an idea. How about everyone mind their own fucking business? So no telling people who they can and can’t marry and no flags everywhere reminding everyone who you are attracted to.

    • eightyraw - Jun 26, 2013 at 10:47 PM

      The Mariners are owned by a Japanese man. But they fly an American flag to remind everyone that Seattle is in America. I say, no flags!

      • joenash72 - Jun 27, 2013 at 2:40 AM

        There is one flag, as an M’s fan, that I long for.

        It’s an AL Pennant !

        That stupid banner hanging at Safeco for “116 wins” in 2001 just doesn’t suffice.

  13. IdahoMariner - Jun 26, 2013 at 10:59 PM

    I am just going to say, thank you Mariners, for acknowledging the presence and support of a portion of your fan base and community.

    And thank you, cur68, old gator, reflex, seattlej, asimonetti88, cohnjusack, indaburg, natslady, heyblueyoustink, stiller43, churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged, eightyraw, sabatimus, lmoneyfresh, historiophilliac, and many more that I am not listing …. for your eloquent and hilarious dissections of the comments filled with ignorance and/or hate. So great, I have nothing to add, just happiness and gratitude that there are so many smart, kind, funny people commenting on my favorite baseball site

    • Reflex - Jun 27, 2013 at 1:11 AM

      Don’t worry, I’ll make a comment soon about the Nats penchant for stockpiling Inverted W pitchers sometime in the near future and everyone can go back to hating me again.

      But I am happy to report that when it comes to posts involving civil rights, my responses will be just as predictable. And that’s a good thing.

    • cur68 - Jun 27, 2013 at 1:55 AM

      If we ignore this sort of post then the loud assholes would win. They’d think they could spew their crap and no one would dare oppose them. I’m certain the others feel the same way. When reasonable people are quiet and let the idiots own the opinion spouting, then we got a problem. No one should just sit quietly by and let hate be the loudest thing heard.

      Anyhow, the reason I spend so much time on this blog is because a good many people like you, Mariner, are here too.
      Cheers.

      • historiophiliac - Jun 27, 2013 at 7:51 AM

        You know, when you string all our handles together like that, we sound less like superheroes and more like assorted dweebs…

      • cur68 - Jun 27, 2013 at 10:01 AM

        Well, we ARE assorted dweebs. The thing is that this doesn’t mean we’re also gigantic fucktards, unlike SOME of the intolerant bastards who commented on this post. I’ll take being a dweeb over that any day.

      • historiophiliac - Jun 27, 2013 at 10:03 AM

        Me too.

      • IdahoMariner - Jul 3, 2013 at 11:56 PM

        I am finally replying, cur, because I am still giggling at gigantic fucktards. If I am giggling a week later, that’s awesome.

    • stlouis1baseball - Jun 27, 2013 at 10:24 AM

      I am with you Mariner. I have nothing to add.
      Everyone you listed (and a few others)…took care of it. Quite well in fact.
      I will just add that Christianity supports inclusion. For those that claim they are Christian to then exclude other members of society based upon their sexual preference (or anything else for that matter) screams hypocrisy.
      That is all I got.

  14. Stiller43 - Jun 27, 2013 at 3:54 AM

    Well said, Mariner…to all your points!

    In glad to see so many of the faces i see on here a lot (i dont often comment…) are not only witty (i already knew that), but also very respectful of their fellow (wo)man. Very glad to see a (beautiful) deeper level of the people who bring me many smirks and sometimes outright laughter throughout the day.

    On the other hand, its saddening to see other people so blind to the plight of normal people with normal lives not being afforded so many rights. And btw guys, touting religion as your big anti-gay argument doesnt make you justified, it makes you a hypocrite. Your religion should teach you love for your fellow man, and to let your god do the judging, since youre also assuredly far from perfect.

    • stlouis1baseball - Jun 27, 2013 at 10:27 AM

      On point Stiller. I just saw your post and specifically…the “hypocrite” jumped right out.
      And the last sentence sums it up.

  15. Stiller43 - Jun 27, 2013 at 4:08 AM

    Jshart1090,

    If its a preference, why dont you “choose” to be gay for a week and try to hit on your same sex that you can obviously flip a switch and feel attracted to, and want to be with.

    Let me know how that works out.

    It really boggles my mind why someone would choose to have to go through many terribly challenging obstacles including coming out to friends/family, who sometimes cut you out completely because they dont believe what youre doing is right, as well as being ostracized by people who dont even know you, just to choose to be gay.

    And fyi, i have a BS in psych. For a short time a few years ago, we looked at multiple identical twin studies (identical twins split at birth, grew up with diff families and diff areas). The studies showed when one twin ID’d themselves as homosexual, there was over a 60% occurence that the other twin also reported as homsexual.

    Two different people, raised by different familes, in different environments, with different friends…and yet a pretty high occurence either both were gay or both were straight. The one similarity? DNA.

    Obviously its not a 100% correlation, but theres certainly convincing evidence out there to prove nature AND nurture are involved in a person being homosexual.

    • jshart1090 - Jun 27, 2013 at 4:44 AM

      Stiller43 – I choose not to sin and live my life to glorify our creator and savior. So no to the first. If you use the DNA arguement, since homosexuals can’t reproduce, that gene would have died out long ago. People go through hardships and are made fun of everyday because we are all sinners. I believe everyone should show a love and respect for one another. I myself have homosexual co-workers, family members, and acquaintances that I have never mistreated. But the love I have for people is a love for their eternal soul as well. I will not accept and tolerate sin as just something that’s suppose to be a normal part of life. This includes lying, murder, adultery, thievery, blasphemy, etc…You along with everyone else should hear about the good news and what Christ Jesus came and accomplished on our behalf. You can choose to reject the Truth, but it is written on all of our hearts, which is why we know from childhood that lying, stealing, etc is wrong without ever having to be told that by our parents.

      • jshart1090 - Jun 27, 2013 at 4:50 AM

        Sorry for quite the long post, but its a pain to do much on my phone. I know a sports site isn’t exactly ideal for this type of discussion, but if you or anyone else would like to continue it email me at jshart1987@gmail.com

      • barrywhererufrom - Jun 27, 2013 at 6:45 AM

        Great post..homosexuality is an abnormality. people are born with disabilities. They should be protected. But to.say marriage can be defined by anything but a man and.woman is against Gods law..so many people have fallen for the lefts argument that this is a.civil.rights issue..no this is breaking down our society.so turns even further from God..no wonder our country is so screwed up..

      • paperlions - Jun 27, 2013 at 7:31 AM

        Aren’t you guys a little old to still have imaginary friends?

        The fact that adults live their lives based on superstition and imaginary friends/enemies is also a disability…though, I wouldn’t go so far as to say they are born with it so much as it is just a result of social indoctrination and intellectual laziness.

      • seattlej - Jun 27, 2013 at 11:33 AM

        There are several critical problems with people using religion to defend their anti-gay position that I just can’t get over.

        First, marriage is not a Christian creation. The institution of marriage existed long before Christ ever roamed the Earth and has been defined in many ways by different groups at different times. Today, in the U.S., what we’re talking about is civil marriage that is recognized by the state. No one is arguing that religious groups should be forced to “re-define” the way in which they view marriage, or at least no one should be making this argument, as it would run afoul of the freedom of religion. This brings me to my second point.

        By claiming religion as the reasoning behind denying marriage to gay couples, you are attempting to impose your religious views on society as a whole. The religious right claim that there’s some societal, liberal assault on your way of life, while at the same time trying to impose your ways on others. Can you not see that there are other viewpoints out there? That maybe, just maybe, there are other ways to view the world that have just as much legitimacy as yours? Or has your unwavering Christian faith simply made you too blind to see that?

        The legalization of gay marriage doesn’t impose anything on you — it won’t change you’re life at all. This isn’t an either/or scenario. Allowing gay marriage doesn’t make your (or my) heterosexual marriage any less cherished or beautiful. It simply allows a whole class of people to have that same experience and allows it to be recognized by the state (not to mention that it also allows all of those state benefits that are available to us).

        The fact is that your disapproval over the morality of homosexuality can coexist with your support for gay marriage. No one will force you to go to a gay couple’s wedding or will hold your eyelids open and force you to watch bad reruns of Will and Grace. Your life wouldn’t change at all. But still, you choose to deny to others the things that you take for granted. If their religion or system of belief tells them that it’s acceptable, why not embrace that? Why continue to force your beliefs down their throat?

  16. barrywhererufrom - Jun 27, 2013 at 9:18 AM

    paperlions..imaginary friends? who are you refering too?

  17. denisescoubidou - Jun 28, 2013 at 3:09 AM

    It would be great if all the gay players in both dugouts picked that day to show the world how proud they are to be gay and come out.

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