Aug 30, 2013, 8:23 AM EDT
This is in keeping with my observation from the other day that, when talking about the pitchers of yesteryear and their heavy work loads, people almost always talk about the exceptional and other-worldly talented, not the ones who never made it because their arms blew out.
Here’s Tom Seaver talking to Bill Madden of the Daily News about how today’s pitchers get hurt because they’re coddled, and how his generation (and the generation before) was not coddled and look how good they were:
“Take a look at all of them, Marichal, Jenkins, Spahn, what do you think made them successful?” Seaver asked. “They conditioned their arms by pitching more, not less, starting from when they signed their first contract. Jenkins threw 300 or more innings half a dozen (actually five) times. Same with Palmer, Carlton and Marichal. I keep going back to that (July 2, 1963) Marichal-Spahn game when they both pitched 16 innings and threw almost 500 pitches between them.
“Neither one of them had any adverse aftereffects from it.”
No, they didn’t. And that’s one of the things which made them absolutely incredible pitchers. It’s quite possible, however, that there are tons of anonymous guys who would have come up in the 50s and 60s and had great careers — or even good careers — but never did because they blew out their arms in Double-A or two years into their major league career and were done for.
The point isn’t that coddling pitchers is the way to prevent injuries. Obviously guys still get hurt, so Seaver’s points about coddling not being the answer could have a lot of validity to them. His point that we don’t know what’s going to lead to injuries certainly has validity, because we don’t. The point is that Hall of Famers like him and Marichal and others are not the best examples of a better way of doing things precisely because they were, by definition, exceptional.
I am certain there are pitchers in the game today who could log the innings that those guys did and be just fine. Felix Hernandez? Justin Verlander? CC Sabathia? There have to be several. But there are tons of guys who fate and physiology are not going to allow to do that, just as there are guys who pitched alongside Seaver back in the day who could not do it either without blowing out their arms.
Teams and doctors need to figure out how to help those guys. How to tailor workloads and physical regimens to — if possible — prevent catastrophic injuries from occurring. Maybe that is futile. Maybe there is absolutely no way to prevent this stuff. But I feel like it’s worth trying to do that with the best information and evidence we can rather than to just throw up our hands, say “there’s no hope” and immediately go back to four-man rotations and 300 inning workloads for everyone.
Because while that did work for Tom Seaver and Fergie Jenkins, it didn’t work for a lot of Joe Shlabotniks whose careers were over before they began thanks to blown out arms.
Oct 31, 2014, 6:05 PM EDT
Madison Bumgarner’s post-season performance prompted Jockey to make underwear with “Mad Bum” on the backside, a special gift to Giants fans at Friday’s World Series parade in San Francisco.
Oct 31, 2014, 5:17 PM EDT
This season Hawkins became one of 16 pitchers in MLB history with 1,000 or more appearances and if healthy he’ll move into the top 10 next season.
Oct 31, 2014, 4:34 PM EDT
But will he accept it?
Oct 31, 2014, 4:26 PM EDT
Rios is now a free agent coming off a season in which he hit .280 with four homers and a .709 OPS in 131 games.
Oct 31, 2014, 4:00 PM EDT
The end of this awkward, orchestrated process is in sight.
Oct 31, 2014, 3:50 PM EDT
He’ll be eligible for free agency next offseason at age 34.
Oct 31, 2014, 3:20 PM EDT
Both players will reject the offers.
Oct 31, 2014, 2:55 PM EDT
Here we go.
Oct 31, 2014, 2:44 PM EDT
Dirks missed the entire season following back surgery and then a hamstring injury.
Oct 31, 2014, 2:30 PM EDT
Go O.D. on some hot trolley action.
Oct 31, 2014, 2:14 PM EDT
Chavez played for the Yankees in 2011 and 2012.
Oct 31, 2014, 2:00 PM EDT
Our last HBT Daily of the year gives a brief taste of the coming winter.
Oct 31, 2014, 1:18 PM EDT
This season he hit just .247 with a .616 OPS in 113 games and Aviles hasn’t cracked a .700 OPS since 2010.
Oct 31, 2014, 1:03 PM EDT
Some random, hypothetical musings on a Friday afternoon.
Oct 31, 2014, 12:12 PM EDT
He was drafted by the Red Sox in 2002 and made 241 starts for Boston.
Oct 31, 2014, 11:47 AM EDT
The only question for next season is what inning he’ll pitch.
Oct 31, 2014, 10:50 AM EDT
Weeks has spent his entire career with the Brewers after being the No. 2 overall pick in the 2003 draft.
Oct 31, 2014, 10:19 AM EDT
Matsuzaka left Japan in 2007 to sign a six-year, $52 million contract with the Red Sox and had immediate success, but dating back to 2009 he’s combined to throw 418 innings with a 5.10 ERA.
Oct 31, 2014, 9:43 AM EDT
The mind reels when thinking of what may appear in such a publication.
Oct 31, 2014, 9:00 AM EDT
Including writeups for the top 63, because we’re not always all about round numbers.
- The Cubs to announce the hiring of Joe Maddon on Monday 28
- Cubs fire manager Rick Renteria, clear way for Joe Maddon 59
- HardballTalk’s Top 150 Free Agents for 2015 24
- Joe Maddon’s pursuit of the Cubs job called “a classless act” by some in the game 113
- Kevin Youkilis opts for retirement at age 35 31
- 10 nominees for Hall of Fame’s Veterans Committee announced 106
- Bochy’s championship resume ranks among game’s best 19
- Alex Gordon would have been a dead duck had he tried to score 83
- A veteran says enough is enough when it comes to tributes for the soldiers (281)
- Jose Canseco shot his middle finger off (148)
- Shocker! Joe Maddon to opt out of his contract and leave the Rays (142)
- Oscar Taveras dies after car accident in the Dominican Republic (140)
- Joe Maddon’s pursuit of the Cubs job called “a classless act” by some in the game (113)