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The Rays demanded the world from Cleveland for David Price

Dec 17, 2013, 1:30 PM EDT

david price getty Getty Images

Terry Pluto of the Cleveland Plain Dealer reports that the Indians asked the Rays what it would take to get David Price. And the Rays said, in essence, everything you got:

When the Tribe talked to Tampa Bay, names mentioned by the Rays were Carlos Santana and Danny Salazar. I was told those two were starting points, and the Rays also wanted some top minor league prospects. I heard Francisco Lindor’s name also was mentioned.

An all-star caliber catcher, a totally promising 23 year-old starter and multiple top prospects? For what will almost certainly be a rental? Fat chance.

If this is at all typical of what the Rays are asking for David Price in a trade, David Price is not going to be traded.

  1. Charles Gates - Dec 17, 2013 at 1:39 PM

    In other words, the Cleveland brass leaked the discussions to show their fans that they’re both asking about high profile players and smart enough to not make that trade. I mean, I’m shocked, SHOCKED that a team would trade a scoop to a reporter for some PR.

    • psousa1 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:56 PM

      Leaks must follow Tito around. He had a GM in Boston who leaked everything but was shrewd enough to let others take the fall.

      • gymtruthteller - Dec 18, 2013 at 7:47 PM

        Or maybe Tito is the leak

    • jeffkx - Dec 17, 2013 at 6:05 PM

      Have to agree. We here in Cleveland are getting sick of hearing how close we are to getting a player or why we don’t get the great players. I’m not a big fan of the ownership/front office here in Cleveland.

  2. zzalapski - Dec 17, 2013 at 1:40 PM

    Note to Andrew Friedman: there is only one Dayton Moore.

    • fanofevilempire - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:08 PM

      Rays are a baseball team on welfare.

      • paperlions - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:15 PM

        Total amount of Yankee earnings from playing baseball against themselves:

        $0

      • spudchukar - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:25 PM

        If this were actually true, then the New York Yankees, who have spent the better part of the past few seasons looking up to the Rays, have nobody to blame but themselves for Tampa Bay’s success.

      • churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged - Dec 17, 2013 at 3:28 PM

        If this were actually true, then the New York Yankees, who have spent the better part of the past few seasons looking up to the Rays

        Yankees’ Rank in AL E:
        ’09 – 1st
        ’10 – 2nd (1gb Rays)
        ’11 – 1st
        ’12 – 1st
        ’13 – 3rd

        I know it’s chic to be all over the Rays, but no, the Yanks haven’t been looking up at the Rays the past few seasons.

      • spudchukar - Dec 17, 2013 at 4:11 PM

        Church you are correct. My bad. In the past 6 seasons the Yanks have won 562 games to Tampa Bay’s 550, or 2 more times a year, so the Rays are actually looking up at the Yanks 82 times a year, while the Yankees are only looking up at the Rays 80 times.

      • madtownthrowdown - Dec 17, 2013 at 9:06 PM

        And the great thing about America is that welfare will support you and allow you to live like your the middle class.

      • indaburg - Dec 17, 2013 at 10:08 PM

        I decided to do what COPO did, but look at it a little closer and for an additional year. Why go back to 2008? I’m not sure why he chose 2009 as his cut off point (5 years seems like a nice number), but 2008 was the first year the Rays had a record over .500 in their entire pitiful existence. I decided not to go prior to 2008 because the data would skew too negative. The Rays/Devil Rays were just too pathetic.

        2008 – Rays 1st/97 wins/$44,970,597 (est payroll)
        Yankees 3rd/89 wins/$212,286,789

        2009 – Yankees 1st/103 wins/$210,330,039
        Rays 3rd/84 wins/$67,270,334

        2010 – Rays 1st/96 wins/$71,923,471
        Yankees 2nd/95 wins/$210,733,389

        2011 – Yankees 1st/97 wins/$206,275,028
        Rays 2nd/91 wins/$41,053,571

        2012 – Yankees 1st/95 wins/$197,977,900
        Rays 3rd/90 wins/$63,368,700

        2013 – Rays 2nd/92 wins/$71,163,500
        Yankees tied for 4th/85 wins/$246,044,750

        Depending on how you look at it, the Rays and Yankees have been “looking up at each other” an equal number of times. Since the Rays have entered what I term the “.500 Era”, they have finished ahead of the Yankees as many times as they have finished behind them: 3. Team salary data was included because it really highlights the difference in value. The Rays really know how to stretch a dollar.

  3. doctornature - Dec 17, 2013 at 1:47 PM

    “If this is at all typical of what the Rays are asking for David Price in a trade, David Price is not going to be traded.”

    Until some contending team’s top starter blows his elbow out in Spring Training

    There is always one dumb owner or one desperate GM trying to save his job (JZ in Seattle?)

    The Rays might not get another Wil Meyers, but they will get a haul.

    They always do. Their GM and scouting department are sharp cookies. Their track record is pretty immaculate and impressive.

    Add to that, Price is better than anyone they have “Posted”…which is what they are doing, in essence. Posting a star to be traded with 2 years left on contract, guaranteeing a huge prospect haul.

    Rays fans may not like it, but they should. The best record since 2008 among low payroll teams, and better than most huge payroll teams, year after year. Their GM should be the highest paid executive in baseball.

    • paperlions - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:45 PM

      Besides Shields, who else has Tampa traded away that got a “big haul”?

      Crawford became a FA.
      Upton became a FA.

      I can’t think of any position player they have traded for a haul.

      They got Torres and Sweeny for Kazmir. Torres has looked good as a lefty reliever through 66 career IP, Sweeney never made it above AA and washed out.

      For Gaza (and a couple MiLB players), they got Archer, Guyer, Lee, Fuld, and Chirinos. Archer looks good so far, Guyer is nearly 28 with 50 career PAs, Lee hasn’t hit yet and and then blew out his knee, Fuld is a fun player who is essentially a replacement level talent, and Chirinos was traded to Texas for cash.

      So, Archer is nice, but not really a “haul”. Aside from Dayton Moore being stupid, what “hauls” of fantastic players have the Rays ever acquired when trading a soon-to-be expensive player?

      • bobdira - Dec 17, 2013 at 4:13 PM

        you left off he trade of delmon young that netted Garza, Bartlett and an American league championship,

        you left off the trade that netted Kazmir for a zambrano

      • doctornature - Dec 17, 2013 at 4:13 PM

        I am saying they will get a haul for Price. Bet your ass they will, or go broke. A haul of prospects does not mean they will all be stars.

        Archer and Lee alone for Garza was a steal, whether Lee comes back for injury or not. Garza is one of the most over-rated pitchers, like Dempster, who had a couple decent years. And the total trade was a haul of prospects. You are not going to get 5 #1 prospects in any trade, but he got a great haul.

        Price is going to land some great prospects, and if you want to argue that, you will have to do it with somebody else.

      • paperlions - Dec 17, 2013 at 4:46 PM

        Yeah, I missed the Young trade. I just sorted career WAR for Rays players and looked through the top players, which obviously didn’t include Young.

        One thing that makes it harder to trade for young talent now is that nearly every organization is more acutely aware of its value.

        Price is a very good pitcher, but he’s still a guy with only 2 years of expensive control left, and a pitcher (pitcher’s break). There won’t be very many teams interested in replicating the Myers/Shields deal. Most teams would rather have Myers than Price because of age, cost, and value.

  4. davidbrentfan - Dec 17, 2013 at 1:48 PM

    Smart move by Cleveland. Price is not worth this.

    • Charles Gates - Dec 17, 2013 at 1:54 PM

      You, mean the prospects aren’t worth the Price?

      • psousa1 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:53 PM

        Badda..Boom..pshh

  5. davidbrentfan - Dec 17, 2013 at 1:57 PM

    I just looked at his numbers, and they are not nearly as good as I had imagined they would be.

    2011: 3.49 ERA, 108 ERA+
    2012: 2.56 ERA, 150 ERA+
    2013: 3.33 ERA, 114 ERA+

    So in the past three years, he has only had 1 season that even approaches being star level (granted, it was superstar level).

    A very good pitcher, but certainly can’t be counted on to put up a star performance.

    • stex52 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:06 PM

      You may want to recalibrate your expectations a bit. I suggest you look at innings pitched, WHIP and SO/BB ratio. I would also take into account that he was hurt a good part of 2013 and still put up 186 innings. He’s a #1 on most staffs.

      • stex52 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:11 PM

        Oh yeah, and I forgot. He’s a lefty.

      • davidbrentfan - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:14 PM

        He has a career OPS+ of 122. That is ‘very good’ at best.
        He has had 2 great seasons, 1 good season, 1 pretty good season, and 1 average season. He is not a great pitcher on a regular basis. Far from it.

      • davidbrentfan - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:14 PM

        ERA+

      • stex52 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:23 PM

        I’m not saying he is worth that deal. Scarcely anyone in the league is. But if you only look at ERA+ I think you are seriously undervaluing Price.

      • raysfan1 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:49 PM

        David, your standards appear to be extremely high if you consider an ERA+ of 122 to be “very good at best.”

        Since you cherry picked ERA+, here’s a couple examples back to you…
        Tom Seaver has a career ERA+ 127, but Nolan Ryan’s is 112. If Price is “very good at best,” then what is Nolan Ryan?

      • bendover09 - Dec 17, 2013 at 3:09 PM

        Forget regular season … He is 1-4 during post season with ERA over 5.30

      • raysfan1 - Dec 17, 2013 at 3:39 PM

        A little extra reading on small sample size fallacies:

        http://m.voices.yahoo.com/critical-thinking-fallacies-small-6199998.html

    • jrobitaille23 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:23 PM

      He faces some pretty good hitting teams all year as well

      • paperlions - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:54 PM

        And pitches in one of the most pitcher friendly parks.

  6. raysfan1 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:02 PM

    I’ve said it repeatedly, and will now say it again…
    The Rays are in a position to win now. They will not trade David Price for a package that makes them less likely to win now. The cost to get him this year will be higher than the cost was to get James Shields–ie, somebody would have to give them more than a major league ready bat and a major league ready pitcher.

    Next off season the cost to get him will be lower, and I expect he does get moved then. This year? Probably not unless some team wants a Cy Young caliber pitcher enough to pay through the nose.

    • spudchukar - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:21 PM

      Yeah my take on the Rays demands, “Thanks for the interest, but to be honest you guys don’t have anybody that would help our team. Only Salazar and Santana pique our interest, and even both of them would require a couple of top prospects for us to consider moving Price in your direction.”

    • 18thstreet - Dec 18, 2013 at 10:58 AM

      Totally agree. If the Rays are going to rebuild, they ought to wait until the Yankees are stronger. Honestly — and I say this as a Red Sox fan — it’s unlikely that so many things break the Red Sox’ way this season. As presently constituted, the Rays seem to match up well with Boston as the best team in the division. It’s not unreasonable to think that Victorino and Koji take big steps backward this year (no one thought they’d be that good) or that it will be hard to compensate for the the loss of Ellsbury. I’m obviously hoping that’s not the case.

      If the Rays trade Price in order to be better in 2016, they may find that the Red Sox and Yankees are much strong then. I think they should try to win now.

  7. cur68 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:02 PM

    Only a total nitwit trades Danny Salazar right now. He’s got easy gas. Damn near 100mph gas. He needs to learn to change speeds and then he’ll be devastating (barring injury). If he has learned, then he’s gonna be amaze-balls this coming season.

    • stex52 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:44 PM

      Total nitwits? Are you suggesting the Astros and Marlins collaborate on a three-way trade?

      • cur68 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:54 PM

        Hey! No three ways! Anyhow, Mark Shapiro would have to lose his damn mind to even consider Danny Salazar in trade for just about anyone.

  8. doctornature - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:03 PM

    He is WAY better than Shields. He is left-handed and throws 95-98.

    They will have their pick of some top-notch offers, you can count on that. Face it, most prospects don’t pan out. You need 3-4 TOP prospects to get 1 very good player usually. And their are several teams like Boston, Texas, Mariners, with loaded farms. Someone will bite for Price. Arms from the left side like his are rare.

    • stex52 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:15 PM

      I think Raysfan is onto it. They don’t want to trade him now. Talk to them in July if they are out of the race, or talk to them next year. If you get him now you pay double because they want to hold onto him for 2014.

      • doctornature - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:32 PM

        I would agree. They have time, and to get him NOW, you better come bearing gifts aplenty. They have a very competitive team now, and will not accept anything that does not blow them away, because with that staff they have about as good a chance as anybody to get to the WS.

        But my guess is that the team with the best farm system that does NOT get Tanaka..which excludes the Yanks, whose cupboard is bare down on the farm…will jump for Price in a big way. Mariners GM is desperate to save his job, and has Walker, Pultzen, and many others to Dangle. Dodgers and Rangers have interesting pieces. D-Backs are itching for Tanaka and may bite on Price if they don’t get him.

        The Rays don’t make hasty moves. If they don’t move him by April 1st, they will re-assess at the AS Break. If they are in the race, they keep him. If not, a contender is still going to jump at him to get them over the hump. The offers at the break will still be formidable, if not better, since the lure of a WS berth will be right before their eyes.

        Whatever happens, and when, I still see the Rays return as being in the range of the Rangers’ Texeira trade to Atlanta with 1 1/2 years left on the contract. Especially if Price has a 1st half like his 2nd half last year.

      • stex52 - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:41 PM

        If he has a typical first half and – for some reason – the Rays don’t; they will get a huge haul for him in July. One contender will see him as exactly what they need. And they may well be right.

  9. largebill - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:14 PM

    The longer TB waits the lower the return since you’re talking a shorter rental. Indians would be idiots to make this trade. Especially if it includes Salazar and Lindor. Santana is not untouchable, but the others should be nearly untouchable.

  10. djpostl - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:19 PM

    “If this is at all typical of what the Rays are asking for David Price in a trade, David Price is not going to be traded.”

    It only takes ONE idiot for a GM to make this false.

    And we absolutely know there is always one idiot GM floating around out there.

    I could see the Dodgers giving them all-star talent, paying half that guys salary and tossing in several attractive young prospects. Hell, they’d prpbaly absorb TB’s worst contract or two to facilitate it.

  11. aphillieated - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:28 PM

    The Indians we’re like “Naaah”

  12. astutefl - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:29 PM

    The Rays haven’t won 90+ games each of the last 4 years by giving pitchers away, or trading them for what other teams, or other teams fans THINK they should get. It’s the Rays player, and the Rays decide the going rate. If you don’t like it, shop somewhere else.

    • doctornature - Dec 17, 2013 at 2:38 PM

      “We’ll give you 3 scrubs and a PTBNL for Ruth and Gehrig”

      You got it right there, astutefl. I LMAO when I read suggested trades by fans. Most are made by living brain donors, it seems. But the chuckles are worth the time wasted reading them.

  13. negaduck - Dec 17, 2013 at 4:29 PM

    listen up nerds,

    this guy is a 3x ALLSTAR…2 time player choice…runner up cy…AND CY

    also CLEAN sweep of every college award…NEVER BEEN DONE RT
    Brooks Wallace award winner too

    • paperlions - Dec 17, 2013 at 4:51 PM

      So what?

      None of that matters.

      You don’t trade players, you trade contracts. In Price you get 2 expensive years of potentially elite pitching, that is worth more than his salary…but not THAT much more.

      • pastabelly - Dec 17, 2013 at 7:58 PM

        With no chance of resigning him and only a small chance of getting to the WS with him, it makes even less sense. Tampa Bay should “rent” their own player and try to win it all the next two years. Teams do this all of the time.

    • churchoftheperpetuallyoutraged - Dec 17, 2013 at 7:16 PM

      listen up you nerds, I’m going to list a bunch of statistics that you’ll probably counter with other statistics, but mine are for jocks and yours are for nerds

      FTFY

    • 18thstreet - Dec 18, 2013 at 11:04 AM

      No one denies that he’s great. That he was great in college is about the least relevant piece of information that you could provide. You know who else was great in 2007? Most of the 2013 Yankees.

  14. Carl Hancock - Dec 17, 2013 at 7:39 PM

    The Mariners gave a 31 year old Robinson Cano a 10 year deal for $240 million so I’d say anything is possible in MLB today. I’m sure the Rays will get a nice haul for Price.

  15. spc7ray - Dec 19, 2013 at 7:26 PM

    Well it looks like he wont be a Dodger–Im glad the Indians opened everyone up to whats happening–Besides I want the Dodgers to go after Giancarlo Stanton–make the deal

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